18.04 = circular login problem on system freeze

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18.04 = circular login problem on system freeze

Wade Smart-2
I just installed 18.04 this week and have been testing it out.
Earlier today I clicked on Show Applications an the screen froze.
After several minutes it logged me out and when I tried to log back in -
Im immediately logged out. This is a similar problem I was having with
17.10 recently. (This is a fresh install).

Thankfully I have a second account to login with and I was going through
the logs looking for something .. anything at the time this happened. This
is what Ive found so far:

Jul  9 17:51:23 wadesmart gnome-shell[11940]: Error looking up
permission: GDBus.Error:org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.ServiceUnknown: The
name org.freedesktop.impl.portal.PermissionStore was not provided by
any .service files
Jul  9 17:51:23 wadesmart gnome-shell[11940]:
[AppIndicatorSupport-WARN] Attempting to re-register
:1.185/org/ayatana/NotificationItem/multiload; resetting instead
Jul  9 17:51:23 wadesmart gnome-shell[11940]:
[AppIndicatorSupport-WARN] Item
:1.185/org/ayatana/NotificationItem/multiload is already registered
Jul  9 17:51:23 wadesmart gnome-shell[11940]: Some code accessed the
property 'refreshPropertyOnProxy' on the module 'util'. That property
was defined with 'let' or 'const' inside the module. This was
previously supported, but is not correct according to the ES6
standard. Any symbols to be exported from a module must be defined
with 'var'. The property access will work as previously for the time
being, but please fix your code anyway.
Jul  9 17:51:23 wadesmart gnome-shell[11940]:
[AppIndicatorSupport-WARN] Attempting to re-register
:1.185/org/ayatana/NotificationItem/multiload; resetting instead
Jul  9 17:51:23 wadesmart gnome-shell[11940]:
[AppIndicatorSupport-WARN] Item
:1.185/org/ayatana/NotificationItem/multiload is already registered
Jul  9 17:51:23 wadesmart gnome-shell[11940]:
[AppIndicatorSupport-WARN] Attempting to re-register
:1.61/org/ayatana/NotificationItem/dropbox_client_2204; resetting
instead
Jul  9 17:51:23 wadesmart gnome-shell[11940]:
[AppIndicatorSupport-WARN] Item
:1.61/org/ayatana/NotificationItem/dropbox_client_2204 is already
registered
Jul  9 17:51:23 wadesmart gnome-shell[11940]:
[AppIndicatorSupport-WARN] while calling AboutToShow: Gio.IOErrorEnum:
Method 'com.canonical.dbusmenu.AboutToShow' returned type '()', but
expected '(b)'
Jul  9 17:51:23 wadesmart org.gnome.Shell.desktop[11940]: **
Jul  9 17:51:23 wadesmart org.gnome.Shell.desktop[11940]:
Gtk:ERROR:../../../../gtk/gtkicontheme.c:4261:gtk_icon_info_load_icon_finish:
assertion failed: (icon_info_get_pixbuf_ready (icon_info))
Jul  9 17:51:23 wadesmart org.gnome.Shell.desktop[11940]: == Stack
trace for context 0x561afef634d0 ==
Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart indicator-multi[11264]: Unable to connect to
the Notification Watcher:
GDBus.Error:org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.NoReply: Message recipient
disconnected from message bus without replying
Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart indicator-multi[11264]: Unable to connect to
the Notification Watcher:
GDBus.Error:org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.NoReply: Message recipient
disconnected from message bus without replying
Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart gnome-session[1831]:
gnome-session-binary[1831]: GnomeDesktop-WARNING: Failed to acquire
idle monitor proxy: GDBus.Error:org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.NoReply:
Message recipient disconnected from message bus without replying
Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart gnome-session-binary[1831]:
GnomeDesktop-WARNING: Failed to acquire idle monitor proxy:
GDBus.Error:org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.NoReply: Message recipient
disconnected from message bus without replying
Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart gnome-session-binary[1831]: WARNING:
Application 'org.gnome.Shell.desktop' killed by signal 6
Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart gnome-session[1831]:
gnome-session-binary[1831]: WARNING: Application
'org.gnome.Shell.desktop' killed by signal 6
Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart gnome-session[1831]:
gnome-session-binary[1831]: WARNING: App 'org.gnome.Shell.desktop'
respawning too quickly
Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart gnome-session-binary[1831]: WARNING: App
'org.gnome.Shell.desktop' respawning too quickly
Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart gnome-session-binary[1831]: Unrecoverable
failure in required component org.gnome.Shell.desktop
Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart gnome-session[1831]:
gnome-session-binary[1831]: CRITICAL: We failed, but the fail whale is
dead. Sorry....
Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart gnome-session-binary[1831]: CRITICAL: We
failed, but the fail whale is dead. Sorry....
Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart dropbox.desktop[2173]: ICE default IO error
handler doing an exit(), pid = 2204, errno = 11
Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart at-spi-bus-launcher[1947]: XIO:  fatal IO
error 11 (Resource temporarily unavailable) on X server ":0"
Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart at-spi-bus-launcher[1947]:       after 15605
requests (15605 known processed) with 0 events remaining.
Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart gsd-xsettings[2092]: gsd-xsettings: Fatal IO
error 104 (Connection reset by peer) on X server :0.
Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart gsd-wacom[2096]: gsd-wacom: Fatal IO error
11 (Resource temporarily unavailable) on X server :0.
Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart kernel: [82661.114813] rfkill: input handler enabled
Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart gsd-power[2069]: gsd-power: Fatal IO error
11 (Resource temporarily unavailable) on X server :0.
Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart gsd-clipboard[2109]: gsd-clipboard: Fatal IO
error 11 (Resource temporarily unavailable) on X server :0.
Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart gsd-color[2108]: gsd-color: Fatal IO error
11 (Resource temporarily unavailable) on X server :0.
Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart gsd-keyboard[2120]: gsd-keyboard: Fatal IO
error 11 (Resource temporarily unavailable) on X server :0.
Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart gsd-media-keys[2117]: gsd-media-keys: Fatal
IO error 11 (Resource temporarily unavailable) on X server :0.
Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart nautilus-deskto[2174]: nautilus-desktop:
Fatal IO error 11 (Resource temporarily unavailable) on X server :0.
Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart nautilus[7367]: nautilus: Fatal IO error 11
(Resource temporarily unavailable) on X server :0.
Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart firefox[5483]: firefox: Fatal IO error 11
(Resource temporarily unavailable) on X server :0.
Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart libreoffice-calc.desktop[5324]: X IO Error
Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart pidgin.desktop[10383]: Pidgin: Fatal IO
error 11 (Resource temporarily unavailable) on X server :0.
Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart indicator-multi[11264]: indicator-multiload:
Fatal IO error 11 (Resource temporarily unavailable) on X server :0.
Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart /usr/lib/gdm3/gdm-x-session[1820]: (**)
Option "fd" "24"

I am unable to log to that account at the moment without it kicking me
right back out.

Wade
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Re: 18.04 = circular login problem on system freeze

Wade Smart-2
This morning while searching for answers I found this in the log after
I was kicked back out:

spice-vdagent,
Cannot access vdagent virtio channel /dev/virtio-ports/com.redhat.spice.0
priority 3

gnome-session-b
CRITICAL: We failed, but the fail whale is dead. Sorry....
priority 2

gnome-session-b
Unrecoverable failure in required component org.gnome.Shell.desktop
priority 3

Though some have had similar issues t was video card related.
This seems to be something else.

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Linux since June 2005


On Mon, Jul 9, 2018 at 7:12 PM, Wade Smart <[hidden email]> wrote:

> I just installed 18.04 this week and have been testing it out.
> Earlier today I clicked on Show Applications an the screen froze.
> After several minutes it logged me out and when I tried to log back in -
> Im immediately logged out. This is a similar problem I was having with
> 17.10 recently. (This is a fresh install).
>
> Thankfully I have a second account to login with and I was going through
> the logs looking for something .. anything at the time this happened. This
> is what Ive found so far:
>
> Jul  9 17:51:23 wadesmart gnome-shell[11940]: Error looking up
> permission: GDBus.Error:org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.ServiceUnknown: The
> name org.freedesktop.impl.portal.PermissionStore was not provided by
> any .service files
> Jul  9 17:51:23 wadesmart gnome-shell[11940]:
> [AppIndicatorSupport-WARN] Attempting to re-register
> :1.185/org/ayatana/NotificationItem/multiload; resetting instead
> Jul  9 17:51:23 wadesmart gnome-shell[11940]:
> [AppIndicatorSupport-WARN] Item
> :1.185/org/ayatana/NotificationItem/multiload is already registered
> Jul  9 17:51:23 wadesmart gnome-shell[11940]: Some code accessed the
> property 'refreshPropertyOnProxy' on the module 'util'. That property
> was defined with 'let' or 'const' inside the module. This was
> previously supported, but is not correct according to the ES6
> standard. Any symbols to be exported from a module must be defined
> with 'var'. The property access will work as previously for the time
> being, but please fix your code anyway.
> Jul  9 17:51:23 wadesmart gnome-shell[11940]:
> [AppIndicatorSupport-WARN] Attempting to re-register
> :1.185/org/ayatana/NotificationItem/multiload; resetting instead
> Jul  9 17:51:23 wadesmart gnome-shell[11940]:
> [AppIndicatorSupport-WARN] Item
> :1.185/org/ayatana/NotificationItem/multiload is already registered
> Jul  9 17:51:23 wadesmart gnome-shell[11940]:
> [AppIndicatorSupport-WARN] Attempting to re-register
> :1.61/org/ayatana/NotificationItem/dropbox_client_2204; resetting
> instead
> Jul  9 17:51:23 wadesmart gnome-shell[11940]:
> [AppIndicatorSupport-WARN] Item
> :1.61/org/ayatana/NotificationItem/dropbox_client_2204 is already
> registered
> Jul  9 17:51:23 wadesmart gnome-shell[11940]:
> [AppIndicatorSupport-WARN] while calling AboutToShow: Gio.IOErrorEnum:
> Method 'com.canonical.dbusmenu.AboutToShow' returned type '()', but
> expected '(b)'
> Jul  9 17:51:23 wadesmart org.gnome.Shell.desktop[11940]: **
> Jul  9 17:51:23 wadesmart org.gnome.Shell.desktop[11940]:
> Gtk:ERROR:../../../../gtk/gtkicontheme.c:4261:gtk_icon_info_load_icon_finish:
> assertion failed: (icon_info_get_pixbuf_ready (icon_info))
> Jul  9 17:51:23 wadesmart org.gnome.Shell.desktop[11940]: == Stack
> trace for context 0x561afef634d0 ==
> Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart indicator-multi[11264]: Unable to connect to
> the Notification Watcher:
> GDBus.Error:org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.NoReply: Message recipient
> disconnected from message bus without replying
> Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart indicator-multi[11264]: Unable to connect to
> the Notification Watcher:
> GDBus.Error:org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.NoReply: Message recipient
> disconnected from message bus without replying
> Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart gnome-session[1831]:
> gnome-session-binary[1831]: GnomeDesktop-WARNING: Failed to acquire
> idle monitor proxy: GDBus.Error:org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.NoReply:
> Message recipient disconnected from message bus without replying
> Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart gnome-session-binary[1831]:
> GnomeDesktop-WARNING: Failed to acquire idle monitor proxy:
> GDBus.Error:org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.NoReply: Message recipient
> disconnected from message bus without replying
> Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart gnome-session-binary[1831]: WARNING:
> Application 'org.gnome.Shell.desktop' killed by signal 6
> Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart gnome-session[1831]:
> gnome-session-binary[1831]: WARNING: Application
> 'org.gnome.Shell.desktop' killed by signal 6
> Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart gnome-session[1831]:
> gnome-session-binary[1831]: WARNING: App 'org.gnome.Shell.desktop'
> respawning too quickly
> Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart gnome-session-binary[1831]: WARNING: App
> 'org.gnome.Shell.desktop' respawning too quickly
> Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart gnome-session-binary[1831]: Unrecoverable
> failure in required component org.gnome.Shell.desktop
> Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart gnome-session[1831]:
> gnome-session-binary[1831]: CRITICAL: We failed, but the fail whale is
> dead. Sorry....
> Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart gnome-session-binary[1831]: CRITICAL: We
> failed, but the fail whale is dead. Sorry....
> Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart dropbox.desktop[2173]: ICE default IO error
> handler doing an exit(), pid = 2204, errno = 11
> Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart at-spi-bus-launcher[1947]: XIO:  fatal IO
> error 11 (Resource temporarily unavailable) on X server ":0"
> Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart at-spi-bus-launcher[1947]:       after 15605
> requests (15605 known processed) with 0 events remaining.
> Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart gsd-xsettings[2092]: gsd-xsettings: Fatal IO
> error 104 (Connection reset by peer) on X server :0.
> Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart gsd-wacom[2096]: gsd-wacom: Fatal IO error
> 11 (Resource temporarily unavailable) on X server :0.
> Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart kernel: [82661.114813] rfkill: input handler enabled
> Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart gsd-power[2069]: gsd-power: Fatal IO error
> 11 (Resource temporarily unavailable) on X server :0.
> Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart gsd-clipboard[2109]: gsd-clipboard: Fatal IO
> error 11 (Resource temporarily unavailable) on X server :0.
> Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart gsd-color[2108]: gsd-color: Fatal IO error
> 11 (Resource temporarily unavailable) on X server :0.
> Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart gsd-keyboard[2120]: gsd-keyboard: Fatal IO
> error 11 (Resource temporarily unavailable) on X server :0.
> Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart gsd-media-keys[2117]: gsd-media-keys: Fatal
> IO error 11 (Resource temporarily unavailable) on X server :0.
> Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart nautilus-deskto[2174]: nautilus-desktop:
> Fatal IO error 11 (Resource temporarily unavailable) on X server :0.
> Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart nautilus[7367]: nautilus: Fatal IO error 11
> (Resource temporarily unavailable) on X server :0.
> Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart firefox[5483]: firefox: Fatal IO error 11
> (Resource temporarily unavailable) on X server :0.
> Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart libreoffice-calc.desktop[5324]: X IO Error
> Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart pidgin.desktop[10383]: Pidgin: Fatal IO
> error 11 (Resource temporarily unavailable) on X server :0.
> Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart indicator-multi[11264]: indicator-multiload:
> Fatal IO error 11 (Resource temporarily unavailable) on X server :0.
> Jul  9 17:51:24 wadesmart /usr/lib/gdm3/gdm-x-session[1820]: (**)
> Option "fd" "24"
>
> I am unable to log to that account at the moment without it kicking me
> right back out.
>
> Wade
> --
> Registered Linux User: #480675
> Registered Linux Machine: #408606
> Linux since June 2005

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Re: 18.04 = circular login problem on system freeze

Compdoc@hotrodpc.com
On 07/10/2018 11:35 AM, Wade Smart wrote:

> CRITICAL: We failed, but the fail whale is dead. Sorry....

coders = comedians



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Re: 18.04 = circular login problem on system freeze

Wade Smart-2
HAAH I had a few other names for them myself but, yea. :D
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On Tue, Jul 10, 2018 at 12:37 PM, compdoc <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On 07/10/2018 11:35 AM, Wade Smart wrote:
>
>> CRITICAL: We failed, but the fail whale is dead. Sorry....
>
>
> coders = comedians
>
>
>
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Re: 18.04 = circular login problem on system freeze

Liam Proven
On Tue, 10 Jul 2018 at 19:41, Wade Smart <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> HAAH I had a few other names for them myself but, yea. :D

I gotta say, I'm feeling totally vindicated in my decision to steer
very far clear of GNOME 3.

Cinnamon is OK -- I'm using it on one Mint 19 box and another with GeckoLinux.

But my main work machine runs Xfce. Everything just works. It's relaxing.

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Re: 18.04 = circular login problem on system freeze

Wade Smart-2
Im reading about a lot of Mint users having various problems.
My laptop though - not a single issue.

G3 might be enough to push me back to 16.04 for a year or so.

--
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On Tue, Jul 10, 2018 at 2:13 PM, Liam Proven <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On Tue, 10 Jul 2018 at 19:41, Wade Smart <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> HAAH I had a few other names for them myself but, yea. :D
>
> I gotta say, I'm feeling totally vindicated in my decision to steer
> very far clear of GNOME 3.
>
> Cinnamon is OK -- I'm using it on one Mint 19 box and another with GeckoLinux.
>
> But my main work machine runs Xfce. Everything just works. It's relaxing.
>
> --
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Re: 18.04 = circular login problem on system freeze

Compdoc@hotrodpc.com
On 7/10/2018 1:18 PM, Wade Smart wrote:

> Im reading about a lot of Mint users having various problems.
> My laptop though - not a single issue.

Ubuntu Mate does very well for me. I used to install Server and then a
minimal mate desktop, but now just use the minimal option during install.

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Re: 18.04 = circular login problem on system freeze

Liam Proven
In reply to this post by Wade Smart-2
On Tue, 10 Jul 2018 at 21:19, Wade Smart <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Im reading about a lot of Mint users having various problems.
> My laptop though - not a single issue.
>
> G3 might be enough to push me back to 16.04 for a year or so.

I have seen some glitches -- Cinnamon needs hardware 3D and good solid drivers.

Xfce doesn't need 3D at all, although it can use it if it's there.
It's lighter than Maté, does pretty much everything Maté does and more
-- such as working vertical taskbars, something Cinnamon and KDE can't
do.

E.g. https://imgur.com/a/fLeAy

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Re: 18.04 = circular login problem on system freeze

Jim Byrnes-4
In reply to this post by Liam Proven
On 07/10/2018 02:13 PM, Liam Proven wrote:
> On Tue, 10 Jul 2018 at 19:41, Wade Smart <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> HAAH I had a few other names for them myself but, yea. :D
>
> I gotta say, I'm feeling totally vindicated in my decision to steer
> very far clear of GNOME 3.

My experience is exactly the opposite. I upgraded my laptop from Ubuntu
16.04 to 18.04 and in limited use have seen no problems.

> Cinnamon is OK -- I'm using it on one Mint 19 box and another with GeckoLinux.

On the same laptop I upgraded Mint 18 with Cinnamon to Mint 19. After
the upgrade completed and rebooted Cinnamon crashed and popped up a
dialog saying it had crashed and I was in fallback mode. At this point I
did have a very basic looking but usable desktop.

I did some googling and found other people with problems also. They were
talking about waiting for a kernel update to fix it.

This laptop doesn't have anything important on it so i googled and found
out how to add Mate along side Cinnamon. Mate seems to run fine, now I
can only boot to Mate even if I choose Cinnamon.

I noticed a couple of things after the Mint upgrade. About 10 seconds
after I choose Mint at the grub menu the screen turns purple and the
words Ubuntu 19 are centered on it.

It then takes about 3 and a half minutes to get to to the login prompt.

Once I get a chance I will remove Cinnamon and see if that improves things.

Regards,  Jim


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Re: 18.04 = circular login problem on system freeze

Liam Proven
On Wed, 11 Jul 2018 at 00:05, Jim <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> My experience is exactly the opposite. I upgraded my laptop from Ubuntu
> 16.04 to 18.04 and in limited use have seen no problems.

I upgraded my testbed machine to 17.10 and I was surprised at how well
GNOME picked up my Unity settings -- even adding Unity indicators
(weather, system monitor, etc.) in weird distorted but running forms.

I just don't like GNOME 3. I don't see why I should switch between
separate "activities" and normal views -- my mental workflow doesn't
work like that. I don't run one app per virtual desktop -- I have 2
big monitors on all my desktop machines, home and work, and I use
window management to track stuff. I only use virtual desktops on
laptops. I found GNOME's multi-monitor support significantly lacking:
*I* choose where my top panel, dock and desktop switcher go, not my
desktop's programmers, but with GNOME, I can't. Dock and switcher must
be on the same desktop, putting one of them slap in the middle of my
workspace where I don't want it. I use title bars a lot -- I don't
just move stuff, I send-to-back and roll things up and so on. Can't on
GNOME 3, or it's harder and needs tweaks.

If I could use dash-to-panel to merge the dock thing and the top panel
/and put it on one side/ like I do on Windows, it might be OK, but the
developer doesn't support that -- it's top or bottom only.

So I switched to Xfce and it handles it well. Not perfectly, there are
wrinkles, but it works, better than Maté, better than Cinnamon, better
than KDE, and in a more customisable way than LXDE. LXQt isn't ready
-- I tried it, too.

Budgie can do it but very clumsily and clunkily. I must admit, I do
not see the point of Budgie -- it doesn't do anything other desktops
can't do better.

> On the same laptop I upgraded Mint 18 with Cinnamon to Mint 19. After
> the upgrade completed and rebooted Cinnamon crashed and popped up a
> dialog saying it had crashed and I was in fallback mode. At this point I
> did have a very basic looking but usable desktop.

Yeah, I've seen that too. At least when it falls over, it gets back up
and keeps limping along.

Cinnamon suffers the penalty of being a fork. It's forked off what's
now an old version of GNOME 3. Keep current will be a problem for
them.

If they can persuade the Xfce and Maté developers to share the same
set of accessory apps -- the XApps suite -- then that will take a
significant maintenance burden off all 3 of them.

> I did some googling and found other people with problems also. They were
> talking about waiting for a kernel update to fix it.

I blame driver issues, but this is just a guess.

> This laptop doesn't have anything important on it so i googled and found
> out how to add Mate along side Cinnamon. Mate seems to run fine, now I
> can only boot to Mate even if I choose Cinnamon.
>
> I noticed a couple of things after the Mint upgrade. About 10 seconds
> after I choose Mint at the grub menu the screen turns purple and the
> words Ubuntu 19 are centered on it.

*Ubuntu* 19? Not *Mint* 19? Typo?

> It then takes about 3 and a half minutes to get to to the login prompt.

Seems like a long time.

> Once I get a chance I will remove Cinnamon and see if that improves things.

If you can, I'd nuke and reinstall.

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Re: 18.04 = circular login problem on system freeze

Jim Byrnes-4
On 07/11/2018 04:14 AM, Liam Proven wrote:

> On Wed, 11 Jul 2018 at 00:05, Jim <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> My experience is exactly the opposite. I upgraded my laptop from Ubuntu
>> 16.04 to 18.04 and in limited use have seen no problems.
>
> I upgraded my testbed machine to 17.10 and I was surprised at how well
> GNOME picked up my Unity settings -- even adding Unity indicators
> (weather, system monitor, etc.) in weird distorted but running forms.
>
> I just don't like GNOME 3. I don't see why I should switch between
> separate "activities" and normal views -- my mental workflow doesn't
> work like that. I don't run one app per virtual desktop -- I have 2
> big monitors on all my desktop machines, home and work, and I use
> window management to track stuff. I only use virtual desktops on
> laptops. I found GNOME's multi-monitor support significantly lacking:
> *I* choose where my top panel, dock and desktop switcher go, not my
> desktop's programmers, but with GNOME, I can't. Dock and switcher must
> be on the same desktop, putting one of them slap in the middle of my
> workspace where I don't want it. I use title bars a lot -- I don't
> just move stuff, I send-to-back and roll things up and so on. Can't on
> GNOME 3, or it's harder and needs tweaks.

I haven't used it much yet but I am sure I would end up agreeing with
you. I don't like how they keep arbitrarily removing functionality on
what seems like a whim.

> If I could use dash-to-panel to merge the dock thing and the top panel
> /and put it on one side/ like I do on Windows, it might be OK, but the
> developer doesn't support that -- it's top or bottom only.
>
> So I switched to Xfce and it handles it well. Not perfectly, there are
> wrinkles, but it works, better than Maté, better than Cinnamon, better
> than KDE, and in a more customisable way than LXDE. LXQt isn't ready
> -- I tried it, too.
>
> Budgie can do it but very clumsily and clunkily. I must admit, I do
> not see the point of Budgie -- it doesn't do anything other desktops
> can't do better.
>
>> On the same laptop I upgraded Mint 18 with Cinnamon to Mint 19. After
>> the upgrade completed and rebooted Cinnamon crashed and popped up a
>> dialog saying it had crashed and I was in fallback mode. At this point I
>> did have a very basic looking but usable desktop.
>
> Yeah, I've seen that too. At least when it falls over, it gets back up
> and keeps limping along.
>
> Cinnamon suffers the penalty of being a fork. It's forked off what's
> now an old version of GNOME 3. Keep current will be a problem for
> them.
>
> If they can persuade the Xfce and Maté developers to share the same
> set of accessory apps -- the XApps suite -- then that will take a
> significant maintenance burden off all 3 of them.
>
>> I did some googling and found other people with problems also. They were
>> talking about waiting for a kernel update to fix it.
>
> I blame driver issues, but this is just a guess.
>
>> This laptop doesn't have anything important on it so i googled and found
>> out how to add Mate along side Cinnamon. Mate seems to run fine, now I
>> can only boot to Mate even if I choose Cinnamon.
>>
>> I noticed a couple of things after the Mint upgrade. About 10 seconds
>> after I choose Mint at the grub menu the screen turns purple and the
>> words Ubuntu 19 are centered on it.
>
> *Ubuntu* 19? Not *Mint* 19? Typo?
Not a typo on my part. It says Ubuntu 19 on a typical ubuntu colored
background.
>
>> It then takes about 3 and a half minutes to get to to the login prompt.
>
> Seems like a long time.

It does. When I boot to Ubuntu it is much much quicker.

>
>> Once I get a chance I will remove Cinnamon and see if that improves things.
>
> If you can, I'd nuke and reinstall.
>

I think I will wipe out Cinnamon first and see what that does. I may
give Xfce  a try. I briefly ran it years ago.

Regards, Jim



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Re: 18.04 = circular login problem on system freeze

Liam Proven
On Wed, 11 Jul 2018 at 17:40, Jim <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
> I haven't used it much yet but I am sure I would end up agreeing with
> you. I don't like how they keep arbitrarily removing functionality on
> what seems like a whim.

Agreed.

> > *Ubuntu* 19? Not *Mint* 19? Typo?
> Not a typo on my part. It says Ubuntu 19 on a typical ubuntu colored
> background.

:-o Weird!

> It does. When I boot to Ubuntu it is much much quicker.

I'd bet.

Mint 19 on my girlfriend's PC boots in a quarter of the time Win10
does, and it doesn'ty display any weird messages as it does so. I do
have the nVidia drivers installed, though.

> I think I will wipe out Cinnamon first and see what that does. I may
> give Xfce  a try. I briefly ran it years ago.

It hasn't changed much. :-)

The only feature I would like, the one thing, would be to be able to
pin app icons to the taskbar. Other than that, it suits me fine. I
don't particularly want a Windows-like UI, but unless someone can
offer me something better -- e.g. as Mac OS X and Unity do -- then
I'll take it.

But if I have one, I want it to do everything Windows does, at least
as well or better. Xfce pretty much does that for my #1 want --
vertical taskbars. None of the other Windows-like desktops apart from
LXDE/LXQt do that well or at all.

Except app-pinning. That's the one new thing since Win7 that I like.

OK, Win10 has virtual desktops, and I like that, but Linux already did
that for a couple of decades.

The only other improvement, IMHO, is the ability to search
subdirectories in a specified tree for drivers. That's a killer
feature, introduced in Vista, and I've never seen a single other
person comment on it. That alone has saved me *hours*.


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Re: 18.04 = circular login problem on system freeze

Wade Smart-2
I grabbed by backups and decided to go a different direction.
Tried kde. It feels a lot faster. Also seems to have a lot of
useful configuration. But!!!! Tried to install after many days of
testing and .. the install has no visible words. Just check boxes
and three buttons. I think Im installing 16.04 and just sticking with
Unity. It works, its stable, no problems.
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Linux since June 2005


On Wed, Jul 11, 2018 at 10:51 AM, Liam Proven <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On Wed, 11 Jul 2018 at 17:40, Jim <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>>
>> I haven't used it much yet but I am sure I would end up agreeing with
>> you. I don't like how they keep arbitrarily removing functionality on
>> what seems like a whim.
>
> Agreed.
>
>> > *Ubuntu* 19? Not *Mint* 19? Typo?
>> Not a typo on my part. It says Ubuntu 19 on a typical ubuntu colored
>> background.
>
> :-o Weird!
>
>> It does. When I boot to Ubuntu it is much much quicker.
>
> I'd bet.
>
> Mint 19 on my girlfriend's PC boots in a quarter of the time Win10
> does, and it doesn'ty display any weird messages as it does so. I do
> have the nVidia drivers installed, though.
>
>> I think I will wipe out Cinnamon first and see what that does. I may
>> give Xfce  a try. I briefly ran it years ago.
>
> It hasn't changed much. :-)
>
> The only feature I would like, the one thing, would be to be able to
> pin app icons to the taskbar. Other than that, it suits me fine. I
> don't particularly want a Windows-like UI, but unless someone can
> offer me something better -- e.g. as Mac OS X and Unity do -- then
> I'll take it.
>
> But if I have one, I want it to do everything Windows does, at least
> as well or better. Xfce pretty much does that for my #1 want --
> vertical taskbars. None of the other Windows-like desktops apart from
> LXDE/LXQt do that well or at all.
>
> Except app-pinning. That's the one new thing since Win7 that I like.
>
> OK, Win10 has virtual desktops, and I like that, but Linux already did
> that for a couple of decades.
>
> The only other improvement, IMHO, is the ability to search
> subdirectories in a specified tree for drivers. That's a killer
> feature, introduced in Vista, and I've never seen a single other
> person comment on it. That alone has saved me *hours*.
>
>
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Re: 18.04 = circular login problem on system freeze

Liam Proven
On Tue, 17 Jul 2018 at 12:51, Wade Smart <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> I grabbed by backups and decided to go a different direction.
> Tried kde. It feels a lot faster. Also seems to have a lot of
> useful configuration. But!!!! Tried to install after many days of
> testing and .. the install has no visible words. Just check boxes
> and three buttons. I think Im installing 16.04 and just sticking with
> Unity. It works, its stable, no problems.

I have had similar problems trying KDE5 in VirtualBox. It is complex,
cluttered and I don't like it.

I think that unless a fairly stable Unity remix of 18.04 appears, I am
going to switch to Xfce and Xubuntu. It's clean, simple, it just
works, and with some easy tweaks it has a pleasing desktop. It is easy
to enable features such as a vertical taskbar, partly-translucent
title bars (à lá Windows 7), and some useful panel applets (system
monitor, weather forecast, virtual desktop switcher).

The single feature I miss from newer versions of Windows is the
ability to pin apps to the taskbar. You still need a separate "quick
launch" area -- so right now, my taskbar contains 2 icons for
Thunderbird, 2 Chromes, 2 Waterfoxes, etc. One is the launcher and the
other is the running instance. This is clunky and feels old-fashioned
to me these days.

It is my only gripe. Otherwise, it works excellently.

Cinnamon is OK but needs OpenGL drivers, so it doesn't work well in a
VM or on some display hardware. Maté is fine but can't do vertical
taskbars. LXDE is fine and does vertical taskbars, but I can't find
how to assign hotkeys to apps (e.g. Ctrl+Alt+T for Terminal), and it's
end-of-life -- the developers merged the project with the RazorQT
project and LXDE will be replaced by LXQt. LXQt itself isn't ready yet
-- it's missing a lot of functionality. E.g. I can't connect to Wifi
on my test machine.

Xfce isn't flashy or modern but it just works. If you want a top-panel
and an icon dock on the left or bottom, like Mac OS X or Unity, it can
do that too.

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Re: 18.04 = circular login problem on system freeze

Wade Smart-2


On Tue, Jul 17, 2018, 06:30 Liam Proven <[hidden email]> wrote:
On Tue, 17 Jul 2018 at 12:51, Wade Smart <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> I grabbed by backups and decided to go a different direction.
> Tried kde. It feels a lot faster. Also seems to have a lot of
> useful configuration. But!!!! Tried to install after many days of
> testing and .. the install has no visible words. Just check boxes
> and three buttons. I think Im installing 16.04 and just sticking with
> Unity. It works, its stable, no problems.

I have had similar problems trying KDE5 in VirtualBox. It is complex,
cluttered and I don't like it.

I think that unless a fairly stable Unity remix of 18.04 appears, I am
going to switch to Xfce and Xubuntu. It's clean, simple, it just
works, and with some easy tweaks it has a pleasing desktop. It is easy
to enable features such as a vertical taskbar, partly-translucent
title bars (à lá Windows 7), and some useful panel applets (system
monitor, weather forecast, virtual desktop switcher).

The single feature I miss from newer versions of Windows is the
ability to pin apps to the taskbar. You still need a separate "quick
launch" area -- so right now, my taskbar contains 2 icons for
Thunderbird, 2 Chromes, 2 Waterfoxes, etc. One is the launcher and the
other is the running instance. This is clunky and feels old-fashioned
to me these days.

It is my only gripe. Otherwise, it works excellently.

Cinnamon is OK but needs OpenGL drivers, so it doesn't work well in a
VM or on some display hardware. Maté is fine but can't do vertical
taskbars. LXDE is fine and does vertical taskbars, but I can't find
how to assign hotkeys to apps (e.g. Ctrl+Alt+T for Terminal), and it's
end-of-life -- the developers merged the project with the RazorQT
project and LXDE will be replaced by LXQt. LXQt itself isn't ready yet
-- it's missing a lot of functionality. E.g. I can't connect to Wifi
on my test machine.

Xfce isn't flashy or modern but it just works. If you want a top-panel
and an icon dock on the left or bottom, like Mac OS X or Unity, it can
do that too.

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I'be never looked at xubuntu. Since I'm getting no where fast,  I'll check that out today. 


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Re: 18.04 = circular login problem on system freeze

Peter McD
Am 17.07.2018 um 13:53 schrieb Wade Smart:
> On Tue, Jul 17, 2018, 06:30 Liam Proven <[hidden email]> wrote:

>> ...
>> Xfce isn't flashy or modern but it just works. If you want a top-panel
>> and an icon dock on the left or bottom, like Mac OS X or Unity, it can
>> do that too.
>> --
>
> I'be never looked at xubuntu. Since I'm getting no where fast,  I'll check
> that out today.
>

I use xubuntu 16.04.4 in virtualbox, it works and has on my computer
about 2/3 of storage requirements compared to KDE.

On the other hand, I use Kubuntu 18.04, 16.04.4 and have been using KDE
in openSUSE for ages because KDE can be tweaked the way I like it.

I played a bit with Gnome in Fedora and Ubuntu, these GUI are simply
different.

I could work with any of them, but I prefer KDE/Kubuntu because of one
of its mini programs, a real "killer widget", the picture frame.

It allows the presentation in several frames of all your thousands of
pictures hidden in the depth of your HDD at an unused space of your
desktop, giving them the chance to be seen at least occasionally.

cu
Peter

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Re: 18.04 = circular login problem on system freeze

MR ZenWiz
In reply to this post by Liam Proven
On Tue, Jul 17, 2018 at 4:28 AM, Liam Proven <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> I think that unless a fairly stable Unity remix of 18.04 appears, I am
> going to switch to Xfce and Xubuntu. It's clean, simple, it just
> works, and with some easy tweaks it has a pleasing desktop. It is easy
> to enable features such as a vertical taskbar, partly-translucent
> title bars (à lá Windows 7), and some useful panel applets (system
> monitor, weather forecast, virtual desktop switcher).
>
I've been a convert to Xubuntu since 12.04 - cleaner, simpler
interface.  I was on CentOS 4/5 since 2007, then switched to Ubuntu
10.10.  When Unity came around, I didn't like it and jumped to Xfce4
with Xubuntu 12.04 LTS.  Never looked back.  I've tried Linux Mint,
both Cinnamon and Xfce4,, but it's not quite the same underpinnings
and I don't like it.  I don't like SuSE at all, and I much prefer
*bunutu over RH/CentOS, although I use RH/C at work (we use them for
our products).

I don't like launchers at all - I don't like GUIs all that much.  In
WinX, launchers were nice, but I've been a UNIX pro and fan since
1987, proprietary text-only systems before that.  I use keyboard
shortcuts for most of my apps, and Xfce4 provides a nice, easy way to
set them up and port them from machine to machine.  The few launchers
I did use were in the launch panel, which I disabled about 2 years ago
because I got tired of having to keep them up to date when new
versions come out.  I find k/b shortcuts easier to maintain and
typically only have to change them when a major revision change comes
out.  E.g., when LibreOffice switched from 4.x to 5.x, the old
shortcuts didn't work any more, and I created easy ways to get around
that, too.

OTOH, I'm a really long-time fan of and expert at using keyboards
instead of depending on the mouse and a GUI.  If I need to run a
program that isn't in my shortcuts, I just use the menu - it';s easy
enough to get at when necessary.  Most of what I really need is in my
shortcuts.

I run Xubuntu 16.04 LTS on three machines - my home desktop (the
powerhouse), my home laptop, and at work in a VM on my Win10 (eh) work
laptop.  I also help my girlfriend on her Xubuntu 16.04 laptop, to
which I converted her a couple of years ago and she deals with it
quite well (mainly uses it for web browsing, documents (LibreOffice)
and A/V access.

Hope that helps,

MR, Expert Software Developer
FSF Member #12694 http://www.fsf.org
Registered Linux User #472807 http://counter.li.org/

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Re: 18.04 = circular login problem on system freeze

Little Girl
In reply to this post by Liam Proven
Hey there,

Liam Proven wrote:

>Maté is fine but can't do vertical taskbars.

Actually, it's pretty quick and painless to get those on the MATE
desktop. I created a quick blog post and added a couple of
screenshots of my desktop. The first one shows a bottom and left
taskbar. The second one shows two left taskbars and one bottom one.

I don't normally use a vertical taskbar, so I just threw something
together so you could get the idea:

https://mostlylinux.wordpress.com/2018/07/

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There is no spoon.

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Re: 18.04 = circular login problem on system freeze

Dave Stevens
On Tue, 17 Jul 2018 23:02:14 -0400
Little Girl <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Hey there,
>
> Liam Proven wrote:
>
> >Maté is fine but can't do vertical taskbars.  
>
> Actually, it's pretty quick and painless to get those on the MATE
> desktop. I created a quick blog post and added a couple of
> screenshots of my desktop. The first one shows a bottom and left
> taskbar. The second one shows two left taskbars and one bottom one.
>
> I don't normally use a vertical taskbar, so I just threw something
> together so you could get the idea:
>
> https://mostlylinux.wordpress.com/2018/07/
>

and (OT) if you're a hot pink person by all means check out a book
here
https://www.amazon.com/Fag-Plume-Fiction-Robert-Rodi/dp/0452269407/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1531885952&sr=8-1&keywords=fag+hag

 totally over the top

d


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Re: 18.04 = circular login problem on system freeze

Ralf Mardorf-2
In reply to this post by Little Girl
On Tue, 17 Jul 2018 23:02:14 -0400, Little Girl wrote:
>Liam Proven wrote:
>
>>Maté is fine but can't do vertical taskbars.  
>
>Actually, it's pretty quick and painless to get those on the MATE
>desktop.

I guess Liam dislikes how some items of some panels do behave, if the
panel is used vertically. To mate-panel on the left add "Menu Bar - A
custom menu bar".

He also might miss vertically features of the panel. Instead of
positioning mate-panel completely to the left or right side, move it
somewhere between left side and middle or between right side and
middle, while used vertically.

The above examples show two issues I found out by just running
mate-panel for a few seconds.

However, it's possible to use Mate and to add any other panel.

Actually, on openbox I run two horizontal panels at the same time on
top, lxpanel and fbpanel, the combination of those two panels allows
things that are impossible when using mate-panel or xfce4-panel,
furthermore I add items to the panels to run scripts, to select between
an LCD display, VGA monitor or dual mode, all with different settings
such as different resolutions and among other things, those scripts
handle the panels, so that the panels fit to the different settings.
If I would run Mate or Xfce4, I could use the same combination of
lxpanel and fbpanel. Nobody is forced to use Mate with the mate-panel
or Xfce4 with the xfce4-panel.


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