Backing up Ubuntu

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Backing up Ubuntu

Jared Norris
Good evening all,

I've been helping my family set up windows and mac machines lately and been impressed at their backup options. This put me on to looking at my Ubuntu backup options and I feel a little hard done by in comparison, which is odd as it's usually the other way around.

I thought it might just be I don't know all that's out there despite a few hours poking around online so I thought I'd put it out to you all. Is there such a thing as a good back up system/s for Ubuntu ? My use case is to achieve 2 things:
1 - Incremental file history - if I break a config file or other day to day file I'd like to be able to go back to a specific file and restore the single file.
2 - System snapshot - if I really break things I'd like the opportunity to reinstall as it was x amount of time before the break

I can't make the deja-dup tool that comes with Ubuntu do either of these things reliably (it only restores everything from a date and even then, if trying to back up a whole system snapshot it gives errors about being unable to read certain files that are obviously in use).

In the past I've done manual backups with rsync but finding myself looking for something more automated. 

Is there anything out there better than my manual rsync to achieve the 2 types of backups I'm looking for?

Regards,

Jared Norris

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Re: Backing up Ubuntu

ubuntu-users mailing list
Try HDClone by Miray Software - https://www.miray.de/products/applications/hdclone

Sent from my iPad

On Jul 1, 2019, at 06:08, Jared Norris <[hidden email]> wrote:

Good evening all,

I've been helping my family set up windows and mac machines lately and been impressed at their backup options. This put me on to looking at my Ubuntu backup options and I feel a little hard done by in comparison, which is odd as it's usually the other way around.

I thought it might just be I don't know all that's out there despite a few hours poking around online so I thought I'd put it out to you all. Is there such a thing as a good back up system/s for Ubuntu ? My use case is to achieve 2 things:
1 - Incremental file history - if I break a config file or other day to day file I'd like to be able to go back to a specific file and restore the single file.
2 - System snapshot - if I really break things I'd like the opportunity to reinstall as it was x amount of time before the break

I can't make the deja-dup tool that comes with Ubuntu do either of these things reliably (it only restores everything from a date and even then, if trying to back up a whole system snapshot it gives errors about being unable to read certain files that are obviously in use).

In the past I've done manual backups with rsync but finding myself looking for something more automated. 

Is there anything out there better than my manual rsync to achieve the 2 types of backups I'm looking for?

Regards,

Jared Norris
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Re: Backing up Ubuntu

Volker Wysk
In reply to this post by Jared Norris
I'm using dar:
http://dar.linux.free.fr/

It's tar-like but better in many ways, for instance for large  backups.

Bye
V.W.



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Re: Backing up Ubuntu

Wade Smart-2
In reply to this post by ubuntu-users mailing list
Miray Software - bad link.
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On Mon, Jul 1, 2019 at 7:12 AM Dr. Mikeal Hughes via ubuntu-users
<[hidden email]> wrote:

>
> Try HDClone by Miray Software - https://www.miray.de/products/applications/hdclone
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> On Jul 1, 2019, at 06:08, Jared Norris <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Good evening all,
>
> I've been helping my family set up windows and mac machines lately and been impressed at their backup options. This put me on to looking at my Ubuntu backup options and I feel a little hard done by in comparison, which is odd as it's usually the other way around.
>
> I thought it might just be I don't know all that's out there despite a few hours poking around online so I thought I'd put it out to you all. Is there such a thing as a good back up system/s for Ubuntu ? My use case is to achieve 2 things:
> 1 - Incremental file history - if I break a config file or other day to day file I'd like to be able to go back to a specific file and restore the single file.
> 2 - System snapshot - if I really break things I'd like the opportunity to reinstall as it was x amount of time before the break
>
> I can't make the deja-dup tool that comes with Ubuntu do either of these things reliably (it only restores everything from a date and even then, if trying to back up a whole system snapshot it gives errors about being unable to read certain files that are obviously in use).
>
> In the past I've done manual backups with rsync but finding myself looking for something more automated.
>
> Is there anything out there better than my manual rsync to achieve the 2 types of backups I'm looking for?
>
> Regards,
>
> Jared Norris
>
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Re: Backing up Ubuntu

Liam Proven
On Mon, 1 Jul 2019 at 14:24, Wade Smart <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Miray Software - bad link.

https://www.miray.de/products/applications/hdclone.html

P.S. *please* don't top-post. It breaks threading.

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Re: Backing up Ubuntu

ubuntu-users mailing list
I can't comment on Windows and Mac, but AFAIK for Linux there's no such
snapshot option available as for FreeBSD.

What you want, most likely is supported by rsync, but you first need to
shut down your Linux session and e.g. backup the complete install from a
live media.

I'm not using rsync, since I'm in favour of

sudo tar --xattrs -czf

or

sudo cp -ai

and I keep several copies on different external hard disks. However,
you also need to shut down your session and to run tar or cp from a
live media, too.

While rsync much likely provides a history of backups and latest
backups might not be as time consuming, it's still odd. Using tar or cp
is less prone regarding user errors and it's anyway better to spread
backups over several external hard disks.

However, any backup strategy using basic command line options is way
more secure than using special tools. Using a command such as 'dd'
is useful to backup the MBR, but MBRs backups don't gain that much as a
lot of people guess, let alone that for anything else 'dd' is
completely useless, if you want to avoid grotesk issues.

You probably want to go the learning curve that is required to use
rsync, if not consider to do it the same way as I do and use tar or cp.

Don't use special tools, unless you want to check the source code
to check what they actually do, for each update of a tool again and
again.



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Re: Backing up Ubuntu

ubuntu-users mailing list
PS:

Restoring an install by tar or cp never failed for me. Restoring MBRs
using dd never fail per se, but it not always did restore what was
expect. It's tricky insofar, as it not necessarily restores a
bootloader.


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Re: Backing up Ubuntu

diemkae
In reply to this post by ubuntu-users mailing list
Have you looked at "timeshift"?
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On Mon, Jul 1, 2019 at 9:10 AM Ralf Mardorf via ubuntu-users <[hidden email]> wrote:
I can't comment on Windows and Mac, but AFAIK for Linux there's no such
snapshot option available as for FreeBSD.

What you want, most likely is supported by rsync, but you first need to
shut down your Linux session and e.g. backup the complete install from a
live media.

I'm not using rsync, since I'm in favour of

sudo tar --xattrs -czf

or

sudo cp -ai

and I keep several copies on different external hard disks. However,
you also need to shut down your session and to run tar or cp from a
live media, too.

While rsync much likely provides a history of backups and latest
backups might not be as time consuming, it's still odd. Using tar or cp
is less prone regarding user errors and it's anyway better to spread
backups over several external hard disks.

However, any backup strategy using basic command line options is way
more secure than using special tools. Using a command such as 'dd'
is useful to backup the MBR, but MBRs backups don't gain that much as a
lot of people guess, let alone that for anything else 'dd' is
completely useless, if you want to avoid grotesk issues.

You probably want to go the learning curve that is required to use
rsync, if not consider to do it the same way as I do and use tar or cp.

Don't use special tools, unless you want to check the source code
to check what they actually do, for each update of a tool again and
again.



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Re: Backing up Ubuntu

Frank Vanoni
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Re: Backing up Ubuntu

Jim Byrnes-4
In reply to this post by Jared Norris
On 7/1/19 6:08 AM, Jared Norris wrote:

> Good evening all,
>
> I've been helping my family set up windows and mac machines lately and been
> impressed at their backup options. This put me on to looking at my Ubuntu
> backup options and I feel a little hard done by in comparison, which is odd
> as it's usually the other way around.
>
> I thought it might just be I don't know all that's out there despite a few
> hours poking around online so I thought I'd put it out to you all. Is there
> such a thing as a good back up system/s for Ubuntu ? My use case is to
> achieve 2 things:
> 1 - Incremental file history - if I break a config file or other day to day
> file I'd like to be able to go back to a specific file and restore the
> single file.
> 2 - System snapshot - if I really break things I'd like the opportunity to
> reinstall as it was x amount of time before the break
>
> I can't make the deja-dup tool that comes with Ubuntu do either of these
> things reliably (it only restores everything from a date and even then, if
> trying to back up a whole system snapshot it gives errors about being
> unable to read certain files that are obviously in use).
>
> In the past I've done manual backups with rsync but finding myself looking
> for something more automated.
>
> Is there anything out there better than my manual rsync to achieve the 2
> types of backups I'm looking for?
>
> Regards,
>
> Jared Norris
>
>

I use Back In Time. I have restored individual files from past backups
so it satisfies your 1. option. I have never had to do a complete
restore so I don't know about 2. I run it as root so I know it backups
system files. I can't remember for sure but I think I have restored a
couple of system files when I was troubleshooting a problem.

Regards, Jim


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Re: Backing up Ubuntu

Ian Bruntlett
In reply to this post by ubuntu-users mailing list
Hi,

On Mon, 1 Jul 2019 at 14:10, Ralf Mardorf via ubuntu-users <[hidden email]> wrote:
What you want, most likely is supported by rsync, but you first need to
shut down your Linux session and e.g. backup the complete install from a
live media.

Personally, I use tar. However, I do know of a GUI for rsync called grsync

HTH,


Ian

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Re: Backing up Ubuntu

Liam Proven
In reply to this post by ubuntu-users mailing list
On Mon, 1 Jul 2019 at 15:10, Ralf Mardorf via ubuntu-users
<[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> I can't comment on Windows and Mac, but AFAIK for Linux there's no such
> snapshot option available as for FreeBSD.

Ubuntu can run from ZFS -- possibly with an ext2/3/4 partition for
/boot, I've not investigated yet -- and ZFS can do copy-on-write
snapshots.

Mint and openSUSE both support having the / filesystem on Btrfs and
support snapshot-based backups. This is the default for openSUSE.

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Re: Backing up Ubuntu

ubuntu-users mailing list
Let’s try this link for HDclone. It has worked great for me.


Mikeal R. Hughes, D.Min., Th.D., Ph.D.
Minister - Springhill church of Christ
815-546-1867



On Jul 1, 2019, at 9:13 AM, Liam Proven <[hidden email]> wrote:

On Mon, 1 Jul 2019 at 15:10, Ralf Mardorf via ubuntu-users
<[hidden email]> wrote:

I can't comment on Windows and Mac, but AFAIK for Linux there's no such
snapshot option available as for FreeBSD.

Ubuntu can run from ZFS -- possibly with an ext2/3/4 partition for
/boot, I've not investigated yet -- and ZFS can do copy-on-write
snapshots.

Mint and openSUSE both support having the / filesystem on Btrfs and
support snapshot-based backups. This is the default for openSUSE.

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Re: Backing up Ubuntu

ubuntu-users mailing list
In reply to this post by Liam Proven
Another link to tell you about the newest version of HDClone

Mikeal R. Hughes, D.Min., Th.D., Ph.D.
Minister - Springhill church of Christ






On Jul 1, 2019, at 9:13 AM, Liam Proven <[hidden email]> wrote:

On Mon, 1 Jul 2019 at 15:10, Ralf Mardorf via ubuntu-users
<[hidden email]> wrote:

I can't comment on Windows and Mac, but AFAIK for Linux there's no such
snapshot option available as for FreeBSD.

Ubuntu can run from ZFS -- possibly with an ext2/3/4 partition for
/boot, I've not investigated yet -- and ZFS can do copy-on-write
snapshots.

Mint and openSUSE both support having the / filesystem on Btrfs and
support snapshot-based backups. This is the default for openSUSE.

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Re: Backing up Ubuntu

Little Girl
In reply to this post by Ian Bruntlett
Hey there,

Ian Bruntlett wrote:

>> What you want, most likely is supported by rsync, but you first
>> need to shut down your Linux session and e.g. backup the complete
>> install from a live media.

>Personally, I use tar. However, I do know of a GUI for rsync called
>grsync

I scripted my own backups for years, but eventually ended up choosing
Grsync as my tool of choice for backups. Easy to use and fully
extensible. It's one of those "set it and forget it" tools.

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Re: Backing up Ubuntu

ubuntu-users mailing list
In reply to this post by Liam Proven
On Mon, 1 Jul 2019 16:13:05 +0200, Liam Proven wrote:

>On Mon, 1 Jul 2019 at 15:10, Ralf Mardorf via ubuntu-users
><[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> I can't comment on Windows and Mac, but AFAIK for Linux there's no
>> such snapshot option available as for FreeBSD.  
>
>Ubuntu can run from ZFS -- possibly with an ext2/3/4 partition for
>/boot, I've not investigated yet -- and ZFS can do copy-on-write
>snapshots.
>
>Mint and openSUSE both support having the / filesystem on Btrfs and
>support snapshot-based backups. This is the default for openSUSE.

Ok, so a UNIX 'dump' alike thingy is available, too, when choosing an
appropriate file system.

Btw. I have to apologise to the OP, since somehow missed that the OP
is already using rsync and since I mentioned cp and tar, that don't
provide incremental backups. IMHO the OP should stay with rsync.



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Re: Backing up Ubuntu

ubuntu-users mailing list
In reply to this post by Little Girl
On Mon, 1 Jul 2019 11:25:14 -0400, Little Girl wrote:

>Ian Bruntlett wrote:
>
>>> What you want, most likely is supported by rsync, but you first
>>> need to shut down your Linux session and e.g. backup the complete
>>> install from a live media.  
>
>>Personally, I use tar. However, I do know of a GUI for rsync called
>>grsync  
>
>I scripted my own backups for years, but eventually ended up choosing
>Grsync as my tool of choice for backups. Easy to use and fully
>extensible. It's one of those "set it and forget it" tools.

Good point, this IMO is the ultimate solution for the OP. I've written
backup scripts for my preferred way to backup without rsync, too.

If I were the OP, I would write a script or scripts using rsync.

Why do I have concerns regarding grsync, while I don't have any
experiences using it?

This bug,
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pcmanfm/+bug/1782984, does
not only affects pcmanfm on Ubuntu, it does affect a lot of apps on
Ubuntu and other distros.

While writing this email, I needed to restart Claws on my Arch Linux
install ;). I strongly discourage using any GUI and especially using a
GTK2 based GUI for backups.


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Re: Backing up Ubuntu

Gene Heskett-2
In reply to this post by Jared Norris
On Monday 01 July 2019 07:08:00 Jared Norris wrote:

> Good evening all,
>
> I've been helping my family set up windows and mac machines lately and
> been impressed at their backup options. This put me on to looking at
> my Ubuntu backup options and I feel a little hard done by in
> comparison, which is odd as it's usually the other way around.
>
> I thought it might just be I don't know all that's out there despite a
> few hours poking around online so I thought I'd put it out to you all.
> Is there such a thing as a good back up system/s for Ubuntu ? My use
> case is to achieve 2 things:
> 1 - Incremental file history - if I break a config file or other day
> to day file I'd like to be able to go back to a specific file and
> restore the single file.
> 2 - System snapshot - if I really break things I'd like the
> opportunity to reinstall as it was x amount of time before the break
>
> I can't make the deja-dup tool that comes with Ubuntu do either of
> these things reliably (it only restores everything from a date and
> even then, if trying to back up a whole system snapshot it gives
> errors about being unable to read certain files that are obviously in
> use).
>
> In the past I've done manual backups with rsync but finding myself
> looking for something more automated.
>
> Is there anything out there better than my manual rsync to achieve the
> 2 types of backups I'm looking for?
>
> Regards,
>
> Jared Norris

I've been using amanda since around '98-'99. Does incrementels according
to your max level0 intervals and juggles the schedule to try and use the
same amount of media every night.  All automatic, just put it in your
crontab but for additional feel good, you can set up a separate weekly
config to do all level 0's. But I've never felt the need. I use vtapes
on a big hard drive, which means its random access, so recovery's are
done anywhere up to 50x faster than when dealing with expensive and not
near as dependable tapes.

That statement might sound foolish, but the tape drives I've had all
insisted on spending the thanksgiving to new years holidays in Oklahoma
City getting refurbished.  That got tiresome and expensive, so I
switched to vtapes on spinning rust, starting with a 1 terabyte drive,
that when first checked had 25 re-allocated sectors. I put fresh
firmware in it, and 80,000+ spinning hours later, still has only 25
re-allocated sectors.  Had I stayed with tapes I would have had over 2
thousand dollars in replacement tapes tossed in the can.

Now I am about 3/4's of the way thru 60 vtapes  on a 2T drive, backing up
5 machines nightly.  So I have 60 backups, one a night, and when its
used the last one, will reuse the first on again, etc, etc.

Amanda is a strong willed program, but it doesn't run on a schedule you
set other than doing a level 0 within the cycle days you set.  But if
the machine is accessible, amanda will get the job done. Its you who
have to get out of the mindset of doing all level 0's after the close of
business of Friday nights.

Cheers, Gene Heskett
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Re: Backing up Ubuntu

Compdoc@hotrodpc.com
In reply to this post by ubuntu-users mailing list
On 7/1/19 12:35 PM, Ralf Mardorf via ubuntu-users wrote:

> While writing this email, I needed to restart Claws on my Arch Linux
> install;). I strongly discourage using any GUI and especially using a
> GTK2 based GUI for backups.

I noticed several of the suggestions here are projects that havent been
updated in years, which makes me leery of trying them.

Grsync's last update was 2016. Timeshift is more recently updated, but
it seems to lack network support and needs a local drive. I only had one
drive in this system, and it defaulted to storing the snapshots, etc on
the same drive. I do like it, though.

Borg backup has ongoing development, so I'd like to try that next.



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Re: Backing up Ubuntu

ubuntu-users mailing list
On Mon, 1 Jul 2019 13:22:03 -0600, compdoc wrote:
>Grsync's last update was 2016.

Good software not necessarily need updates that often, however, thank
you for the research, since a GTK based GUI definitively requires
better maintenance.

>snapshots

I guess we need to clarify the semantic of the term "snapshot". For
some of us it seems to be a UNIX alike backup thingy providing the
opportunity to backup a running system, IOW to backup everything while
the system is running, so there's no need to shut down and backup from
either another install or a live media. But other might use the term
"snapshot" less specific.

The default ext4 file system used by Ubuntu doesn't allow "snapshots"
in the sense of a UNIX alike "dump", such as e.g. provided by default
FreeBSD installs.


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