Kubuntu 18.04.2 LTS -> Ubuntu 19.04

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Kubuntu 18.04.2 LTS -> Ubuntu 19.04

Volker Wysk
Hi!

I'm about to say KDE goodbye, and switch to Gnome3.

Which is upgraded every half-year as part of Ubuntu. I don't think
there exist PPA's for Gnome, in the same way as for KDE, that give you
the newest Gnome. So I have to drop LTS and "swim with the crowd",
getting a new Gnome version every half-year, as part of Ubuntu.

This means that I have to migrate from my 18.04.2 LTS system to the
newest Ubuntu version.

Can this be done with do-release-upgrade or something like that? I
really don't want to set up everything from scratch _again_. There's a
lot to setup.

Cheers,
Volker



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Re: Kubuntu 18.04.2 LTS -> Ubuntu 19.04

Paul Smith-2
On Fri, 2019-06-14 at 22:26 +0200, Volker Wysk wrote:
> This means that I have to migrate from my 18.04.2 LTS system to the
> newest Ubuntu version.
>
> Can this be done with do-release-upgrade or something like that? I
> really don't want to set up everything from scratch _again_. There's
> a lot to setup.

It is definitely supported to use do-release-upgrade to move between
non-LTS releases; I do it all the time (I don't use fresh install
modes).

However, unfortunately you can't skip non-LTS releases; that's not
supported.  So you can't jump straight from 18.04 to 19.04; you have to
go to 18.10 first then from there to 19.04.

Also, I don't know enough about Kubuntu to say if you can upgrade from
a Kubuntu release to a vanilla Ubuntu release... that's something I've
never really considered trying.

It should be _possible_ because all the packages will have appropriate
names... however of course at best you'll have a lot of leftover
Kubuntu packages lying around on your Ubuntu system.

Given all the above it _might_ make sense to do a fresh install of
Ubuntu 19.04 for this first step, then proceed to use do-release-
upgrade for future upgrades to newer releases.  But, it depends on how
painful that will be for you to re-set up versus cleaning out stuff
after an upgrade.


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Re: Kubuntu 18.04.2 LTS -> Ubuntu 19.04

Volker Wysk
Am Freitag, den 14.06.2019, 17:09 -0400 schrieb Paul Smith:

> On Fri, 2019-06-14 at 22:26 +0200, Volker Wysk wrote:
> > This means that I have to migrate from my 18.04.2 LTS system to the
> > newest Ubuntu version.
> >
> > Can this be done with do-release-upgrade or something like that? I
> > really don't want to set up everything from scratch _again_.
> > There's a lot to setup.
>
> It is definitely supported to use do-release-upgrade to move between
> non-LTS releases; I do it all the time (I don't use fresh install
> modes). However, unfortunately you can't skip non-LTS releases;
> that's not supported.  

It's possible to upgrade from one LTS release to the next, skipping the
non-LTS releases in between...

> So you can't jump straight from 18.04 to 19.04; you have to
> go to 18.10 first then from there to 19.04.
>
> Also, I don't know enough about Kubuntu to say if you can upgrade
> from a Kubuntu release to a vanilla Ubuntu release... that's
> something I've never really considered trying.

That's my question...

> It should be _possible_ because all the packages will have
> appropriate names... however of course at best you'll have a lot of
> leftover Kubuntu packages lying around on your Ubuntu system.

I don't get this. Are you saying that the Kubuntu package names won't
clash with vanilla-Ubuntu package names?

> Given all the above it _might_ make sense to do a fresh install of
> Ubuntu 19.04 for this first step, then proceed to use do-release-
> upgrade for future upgrades to newer releases.  But, it depends on
> how painful that will be for you to re-set up versus cleaning out
> stuff after an upgrade.

That's what I want to avoid. But having a lot of stale packages lying
around isn't an option for me either.

Or, what would cleaning out the obsolete stuff involve..? Is it just
identifying no longer needed packages and remove them? Is there more to
regard?

Thanks,
Volker


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Re: Kubuntu 18.04.2 LTS -> Ubuntu 19.04

Robert Heller
At Sat, 15 Jun 2019 02:52:43 +0200 "Ubuntu user technical support,  not for general discussions" <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
> Am Freitag, den 14.06.2019, 17:09 -0400 schrieb Paul Smith:
> > On Fri, 2019-06-14 at 22:26 +0200, Volker Wysk wrote:
> > > This means that I have to migrate from my 18.04.2 LTS system to the
> > > newest Ubuntu version.
> > >
> > > Can this be done with do-release-upgrade or something like that? I
> > > really don't want to set up everything from scratch _again_.
> > > There's a lot to setup.
> >
> > It is definitely supported to use do-release-upgrade to move between
> > non-LTS releases; I do it all the time (I don't use fresh install
> > modes). However, unfortunately you can't skip non-LTS releases;
> > that's not supported.  
>
> It's possible to upgrade from one LTS release to the next, skipping the
> non-LTS releases in between...

Yes, the *default* behavour of do-release-upgrade when run on a LTS release is
to go to the next LTS release. At least that is what happened when I ran it on
laptops and workstations running 14.04 -- it jumped to 16.04, and then when I
ran it (again) on the 16.04 install, it jumped to 18.04.  I upgraded two
laptops and three desktop machines from 14.04 to 18.04 that way. (I upgraded
the diskless workstations using a fresh install of of 18.04 on a fresh VM and
then just updated things in the DHCP server's dhcpd.conf file.)

I have no clue what do-release-upgrade does on a non-LTS release.

>
> > So you can't jump straight from 18.04 to 19.04; you have to
> > go to 18.10 first then from there to 19.04.
> >
> > Also, I don't know enough about Kubuntu to say if you can upgrade
> > from a Kubuntu release to a vanilla Ubuntu release... that's
> > something I've never really considered trying.
>
> That's my question...
>
> > It should be _possible_ because all the packages will have
> > appropriate names... however of course at best you'll have a lot of
> > leftover Kubuntu packages lying around on your Ubuntu system.
>
> I don't get this. Are you saying that the Kubuntu package names won't
> clash with vanilla-Ubuntu package names?

I would suspect that going from Kubuntu to vanilla-Ubuntu *might* be strange,
but why would you do that?  But I don't know.

>
> > Given all the above it _might_ make sense to do a fresh install of
> > Ubuntu 19.04 for this first step, then proceed to use do-release-
> > upgrade for future upgrades to newer releases.  But, it depends on
> > how painful that will be for you to re-set up versus cleaning out
> > stuff after an upgrade.
>
> That's what I want to avoid. But having a lot of stale packages lying
> around isn't an option for me either.
>
> Or, what would cleaning out the obsolete stuff involve..? Is it just
> identifying no longer needed packages and remove them? Is there more to
> regard?
>
> Thanks,
> Volker
>
>

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Re: Kubuntu 18.04.2 LTS -> Ubuntu 19.04

Volker Wysk
Am Samstag, den 15.06.2019, 00:05 -0400 schrieb Robert Heller:

> At Sat, 15 Jun 2019 02:52:43 +0200 "Ubuntu user technical
> support,  not for general discussions" <[hidden email]
> > wrote:
>
> >
> > Am Freitag, den 14.06.2019, 17:09 -0400 schrieb Paul Smith:
> > > On Fri, 2019-06-14 at 22:26 +0200, Volker Wysk wrote:
> > > > This means that I have to migrate from my 18.04.2 LTS system to
> > > > the
> > > > newest Ubuntu version.
> > > >
> > > > Can this be done with do-release-upgrade or something like
> > > > that? I
> > > > really don't want to set up everything from scratch _again_.
> > > > There's a lot to setup.
> > >
> > > It is definitely supported to use do-release-upgrade to move
> > > between
> > > non-LTS releases; I do it all the time (I don't use fresh install
> > > modes). However, unfortunately you can't skip non-LTS releases;
> > > that's not supported.  
> >
> > It's possible to upgrade from one LTS release to the next, skipping
> > the
> > non-LTS releases in between...
>
> Yes, the *default* behavour of do-release-upgrade when run on a LTS
> release is
> to go to the next LTS release. At least that is what happened when I
> ran it on
> laptops and workstations running 14.04 -- it jumped to 16.04, and
> then when I
> ran it (again) on the 16.04 install, it jumped to 18.04.  I upgraded
> two
> laptops and three desktop machines from 14.04 to 18.04 that way. (I
> upgraded
> the diskless workstations using a fresh install of of 18.04 on a
> fresh VM and
> then just updated things in the DHCP server's dhcpd.conf file.)
>
> I have no clue what do-release-upgrade does on a non-LTS release.

do-release-upgrade has two modes: LTS mode and normal mode. One of the
two is selected in /etc/update-manager/release-upgrades. In normal
mode, it upgrades to the next release (be it LTS or non-LTS).

> > > So you can't jump straight from 18.04 to 19.04; you have to
> > > go to 18.10 first then from there to 19.04.
> > >
> > > Also, I don't know enough about Kubuntu to say if you can
> > > upgrade
> > > from a Kubuntu release to a vanilla Ubuntu release... that's
> > > something I've never really considered trying.
> >
> > That's my question...
> >
> > > It should be _possible_ because all the packages will have
> > > appropriate names... however of course at best you'll have a lot
> > > of
> > > leftover Kubuntu packages lying around on your Ubuntu system.
> >
> > I don't get this. Are you saying that the Kubuntu package names
> > won't
> > clash with vanilla-Ubuntu package names?
>
> I would suspect that going from Kubuntu to vanilla-Ubuntu *might* be
> strange,
> but why would you do that?  But I don't know.

I want to get the newest Gnome. This is in vanilla-Ubuntu, every half-
year.


Bye
Volker


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Re: Kubuntu 18.04.2 LTS -> Ubuntu 19.04

Colin Law
On Sat, 15 Jun 2019 at 07:27, Volker Wysk <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> I want to get the newest Gnome. This is in vanilla-Ubuntu, every half-
> year.

I believe that if you run
sudo apt install ubuntu-desktop^
it will install the standard ubuntu GUI packages.  The caret on the
end is significant.

Colin

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Re: Kubuntu 18.04.2 LTS -> Ubuntu 19.04

Paul Smith-2
In reply to this post by Volker Wysk
On Sat, 2019-06-15 at 02:52 +0200, Volker Wysk wrote:
> > It is definitely supported to use do-release-upgrade to move between
> > non-LTS releases; I do it all the time (I don't use fresh install
> > modes). However, unfortunately you can't skip non-LTS releases;
> > that's not supported.  
>
> It's possible to upgrade from one LTS release to the next, skipping the
> non-LTS releases in between...

Clearly.  I guess I didn't word that as well as I should have.  I
meant, if you're moving FROM or TO *non*-LTS releases, you can't skip
interim releases.

So if you're upgrading from 18.04 LTS, your only supported options are
to go to 18.10, or wait for 20.04 LTS.

If you're upgrading from 18.10, your _only_ option is 19.04.  You can't
go from 18.10 to 20.04 LTS.

> > It should be _possible_ because all the packages will have
> > appropriate names... however of course at best you'll have a lot of
> > leftover Kubuntu packages lying around on your Ubuntu system.
>
> I don't get this. Are you saying that the Kubuntu package names won't
> clash with vanilla-Ubuntu package names?

Right.  The libc package is the same in both, for example.  As best as
I understand it Kubuntu is standard Ubuntu with a bunch of other
packages installed.

It's probably wise to separate this operation into two steps:
upgrading, and switching from Kubuntu to Ubuntu.  I wouldn't try to do
them at the same time.

I would say your most likely to succeed method would be to FIRST switch
your Kubuntu 18.04 to vanilla Ubuntu 18.04.  That is likely the best-
supported transition: moreso than the non-LTS releases.

After that is all set and your system is running Ubuntu 18.04 well and
you've removed all the Kubuntu packages, then do the upgrade process.

> Or, what would cleaning out the obsolete stuff involve..? Is it just
> identifying no longer needed packages and remove them? Is there more to
> regard?

Well.  The only way to be 100% sure there is nothing crufty left lying
around is a fresh installation.

However, you can likely get 90% of the way there by just removing the
Kubuntu desktop packages.  Of course identifying them all could be a
chore.

I did a quick Google search and there are LOTS of articles discussing
how to switch from Kubuntu to Ubuntu without reinstalling.  Many of
them are for pretty old versions of Ubuntu but I expect they work more
or less the same way now.

Mainly, you first install the ubuntu-desktop package which should
depend on everything you need, then you switch your display manager to
GDM and your account login to Gnome.  Then when everything is working
(maybe you can look at running processes to make sure they are gnome-
related not kde-related) you can remove Kubuntu packages.

There is also very likely to be a bunch of user-specific customizations
left in your ~/.config and/or ~/.local directories.  Removing packages
won't help with that.  If you care you'll have to _very carefully_
remove that by hand (of course you shouldn't remove anything used by
packages you still use).

As I said I've never done this, so I can't give more than broad
outlines.


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Re: Kubuntu 18.04.2 LTS -> Ubuntu 19.04

Colin Law
On Sat, 15 Jun 2019 at 16:29, Paul Smith <[hidden email]> wrote:
> ...
> After that is all set and your system is running Ubuntu 18.04 well and
> you've removed all the Kubuntu packages, then do the upgrade process.
>

Is it necessary to remove the KDE packages?  I would not have expected
them to interfere with a gnome ubuntu, or am I wrong there?


Colin

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Re: Kubuntu 18.04.2 LTS -> Ubuntu 19.04

Paul Smith-2
On Sat, 2019-06-15 at 17:08 +0100, Colin Law wrote:
> On Sat, 15 Jun 2019 at 16:29, Paul Smith <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > ...
> > After that is all set and your system is running Ubuntu 18.04 well
> > and you've removed all the Kubuntu packages, then do the upgrade
> > process.
> >
>
> Is it necessary to remove the KDE packages?  I would not have
> expected them to interfere with a gnome ubuntu, or am I wrong there?

It's definitely not necessary, for a properly functioning system.
However, Volker wrote:

> But having a lot of stale packages lying around isn't an option for
> me either.

Hence my suggestion.

Cheers!


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Re: Kubuntu 18.04.2 LTS -> Ubuntu 19.04

Volker Wysk
In reply to this post by Paul Smith-2
> Am Samstag, den 15.06.2019, 11:27 -0400 schrieb Paul Smith:
> > On Sat, 2019-06-15 at 02:52 +0200, Volker Wysk wrote:
> > > > It should be _possible_ because all the packages will have
> > > > appropriate names... however of course at best you'll have a
> lot
> > > > of
> > > > leftover Kubuntu packages lying around on your Ubuntu system.
> > >
> > > I don't get this. Are you saying that the Kubuntu package names
> > > won't
> > > clash with vanilla-Ubuntu package names?
> >
> > Right.  The libc package is the same in both, for example.  As best
> > as
> > I understand it Kubuntu is standard Ubuntu with a bunch of other
> > packages installed.
>
> Yes. And those packages come through the Kubunutu-PPAs, what keeps
> them recent.
>
> But isn't a (older) version of KDE included in *vanilla* Ubuntu? As
> an
> alternative desktop environment? It should be the same with other
> alternatives, like XFCE/Xubuntu.
>
> > It's probably wise to separate this operation into two steps:
> > upgrading, and switching from Kubuntu to Ubuntu.  I wouldn't try to
> > do
> > them at the same time.
>
> Sounds reasonable...
>
> > I would say your most likely to succeed method would be to FIRST
> > switch
> > your Kubuntu 18.04 to vanilla Ubuntu 18.04.  That is likely the
> best-
> > supported transition: moreso than the non-LTS releases.
> >
> > After that is all set and your system is running Ubuntu 18.04 well
> > and you've removed all the Kubuntu packages, then do the upgrade
> > process.
>
> Okay, sounds good.
>
>  
> > > Or, what would cleaning out the obsolete stuff involve..? Is it
> > > just
> > > identifying no longer needed packages and remove them? Is there
> > > more to
> > > regard?
> >
> > Well.  The only way to be 100% sure there is nothing crufty left
> > lying
> > around is a fresh installation.
> >
> > However, you can likely get 90% of the way there by just removing
> the
> > Kubuntu desktop packages.  Of course identifying them all could be
> a
> > chore.
> >
> > I did a quick Google search and there are LOTS of articles
> discussing
> > how to switch from Kubuntu to Ubuntu without reinstalling.  Many of
> > them are for pretty old versions of Ubuntu but I expect they work
> > more
> > or less the same way now.
> >
> > Mainly, you first install the ubuntu-desktop package which should
> > depend on everything you need, then you switch your display manager
> > to
> > GDM and your account login to Gnome.  Then when everything is
> working
> > (maybe you can look at running processes to make sure they are
> gnome-
> > related not kde-related) you can remove Kubuntu packages.
> >
> > There is also very likely to be a bunch of user-specific
> > customizations
> > left in your ~/.config and/or ~/.local directories.  Removing
> > packages
> > won't help with that.  If you care you'll have to _very carefully_
> > remove that by hand (of course you shouldn't remove anything used
> by
> > packages you still use).
> >
> > As I said I've never done this, so I can't give more than broad
> > outlines.
>
> Okay, now I see how it might be accomplished. I have to think it
> over. Perhaps, I'll bite the bullet and do a fresh new installation.
>
> Cheers
> Volker


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Re: Kubuntu 18.04.2 LTS -> Ubuntu 19.04

Robert Heller
In reply to this post by Colin Law
At Sat, 15 Jun 2019 17:08:16 +0100 "Ubuntu user technical support,  not for general discussions" <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
> On Sat, 15 Jun 2019 at 16:29, Paul Smith <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > ...
> > After that is all set and your system is running Ubuntu 18.04 well and
> > you've removed all the Kubuntu packages, then do the upgrade process.
> >
>
> Is it necessary to remove the KDE packages?  I would not have expected
> them to interfere with a gnome ubuntu, or am I wrong there?

It would all be a matter of disk space and on-going updates. If the KDE
packages were left, then they would keep being updated (when one does apt-get
upgrade or whatever). In other words, you'd have a hybrid system of some sort.
I don't know if kdm and gdm would "fight" over who gets to handle the GUI
login process. If kdm was properly disabled, it should not matter, but if an
update re-enabled it by mistake, things might get weird. If the KDE desktop
packages were in place, it might add an option to the login gear menu for a
KDE desktop as well as the Gnome desktop, which could be ignored (or not).  
Again if the defaults were altered somehow (eg some config file update), then
unexpected things might happen, that would have to be fixed, etc.  It might
also have some effect if the system was being used for developement work and
software might get built expecting libraries that were not expected, etc.  
Resulting in unexpected dependencies upon deliverly.

>
>
> Colin
>

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Re: Kubuntu 18.04.2 LTS -> Ubuntu 19.04

Liam Proven
In reply to this post by Volker Wysk
On Fri, 14 Jun 2019 at 22:28, Volker Wysk <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> I'm about to say KDE goodbye, and switch to Gnome3.

Why?

What do you hope to achieve?

> Which is upgraded every half-year as part of Ubuntu.

They both are.

> I don't think
> there exist PPA's for Gnome

Did you look?

https://askubuntu.com/questions/1072096/how-to-install-gnome-3-29-92-or-3-30-in-ubuntu-18-04

> This means that I have to migrate from my 18.04.2 LTS system to the
> newest Ubuntu version.

Why are you obsessing over the latest GNOME if you use KDE?

> Can this be done with do-release-upgrade or something like that? I
> really don't want to set up everything from scratch _again_. There's a
> lot to setup.

Are you running a separate /home filesystem?

You should.

If you do, you can dual boot them & share a home directory between
Kubuntu and Ubuntu GNOME.

Replying to the root message as there's some very confused (& some
bad) advice later in the thread and I do not feel like trying to
clarify/rectify it all.


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Re: Kubuntu 18.04.2 LTS -> Ubuntu 19.04

Volker Wysk
Am Sonntag, den 16.06.2019, 12:23 +0200 schrieb Liam Proven:
> On Fri, 14 Jun 2019 at 22:28, Volker Wysk <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
> >
> > I'm about to say KDE goodbye, and switch to Gnome3.
>
> Why?
>
> What do you hope to achieve?
 
I've been a KDE user for many years, but I've finally come to the
conclusion that it's - still! - too buggy and unstable. I finally want
a system that "just works". I don't want to spend my time fighting with
bugs. Just take a look at the kdepim-users mailing list...

It's a pity, since I think KDE is really good, feature-wise. If it just
worked...


> Which is upgraded every half-year as part of Ubuntu.
>
>
> They both are.I don't think
>
> > I don't think
>
> Did you look?
>
>
https://askubuntu.com/questions/1072096/how-to-install-gnome-3-29-92-or-3-30-in-ubuntu-18-04
>

I've read somewhere that Gnome is released half-year wise, just like
Ubuntu. So (I think), the latest Ubuntu version always contains the
latest Gnome version.

> > This means that I have to migrate from my 18.04.2 LTS system to the
> > newest Ubuntu version.
>
> Why are you obsessing over the latest GNOME if you use KDE?

As I've written: I want do switch to Gnome.

I've used Gnome for some week now, and it *just works*. It's the Gnome
version which comes with Kubuntu 18.04.

>
> > Can this be done with do-release-upgrade or something like that? I
> > really don't want to set up everything from scratch _again_.
> > There's a
> > lot to setup.
>
> Are you running a separate /home filesystem?

No.

>
> You should.
>
> If you do, you can dual boot them & share a home directory between
> Kubuntu and Ubuntu GNOME.

It's perfectly possible to run Gnome and KDE side-by-side in the same
system. That's what I'me doing right now. No dual boot necessary.

>
> Replying to the root message as there's some very confused (& some
> bad) advice later in the thread and I do not feel like trying to
> clarify/rectify it all.

I think I will take the trouble and setup a new, clean Ubuntu 19.04.

What I'm not sure about: Is a KDE version contained in Ubuntu (no "K"),
or is it only in Kubuntu? I don't want to give it up completely. At
least there are some KDE programs which I want to keep using.

I guess I could use the Kubuntu PPAs in order to get Kubuntu programs
in Ubuntu, but is this supported?


Bye,
Volker


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Re: Kubuntu 18.04.2 LTS -> Ubuntu 19.04

Colin Watson
On Sun, Jun 16, 2019 at 02:16:42PM +0200, Volker Wysk wrote:
> What I'm not sure about: Is a KDE version contained in Ubuntu (no "K"),
> or is it only in Kubuntu? I don't want to give it up completely. At
> least there are some KDE programs which I want to keep using.

Ubuntu Desktop [1] and Kubuntu are both part of the same Ubuntu package
archive.  The released images preinstall different sets of packages from
that archive, but each has the same archive available on installed
systems.

Put differently: the Ubuntu Desktop images don't contain KDE, but an
installed Ubuntu Desktop system can install KDE-based packages just as
an installed Kubuntu system can.  Many Ubuntu Desktop users use the odd
KDE-based package, just as they use any of a wide variety of other
packages that aren't actually part of the base installation.

[1] I'm clarifying this in a way that would normally be a bit pedantic,
    as unmarked "Ubuntu" can be used to refer to either the "flagship"
    desktop and server editions, or to the package archive (or indeed
    project) as a whole.

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Re: Kubuntu 18.04.2 LTS -> Ubuntu 19.04

ubuntu-users mailing list
In reply to this post by Volker Wysk
On Sun, 16 Jun 2019 14:16:42 +0200, Volker Wysk wrote:
>What I'm not sure about: Is a KDE version contained in Ubuntu (no "K"),
>or is it only in Kubuntu?

Hi,

I'm not on 19.04. However, regarding the package search at least
the meta-packages are provided, for 19.04, too.

kubuntu-desktop is a hard dependency of kubuntu-full

https://packages.ubuntu.com/disco/kubuntu-full

https://packages.ubuntu.com/disco/kubuntu-desktop

you might want to install one of those meta-packages.

Likely 19.04 also provides the tasks. I don't know if it makes a
difference, if you install a task or a meta-package. AFAIK by
installing the meta-package, you automatically install the task, since
tasksel is installed by default and IIUC if it is installed, then apt
automatically installs the task.

You don't need to add a PPA to get the regular Kubuntu packages, since
thy are provided by the official "universe" repository.

[weremouse@moonstudio ~]$ lsb_release -d
Description: Ubuntu 16.04.6 LTS
[weremouse@moonstudio ~]$ tasksel --list-task | grep kubu
u kubuntu-live Kubuntu live CD
u kubuntu-desktop Kubuntu desktop
u kubuntu-full Kubuntu full
[weremouse@moonstudio ~]$ apt list '*kubu*'
Listing... Done
kubuntu-active/xenial 1.338 amd64
kubuntu-debug-installer/xenial 16.04ubuntu2 amd64
kubuntu-debug-installer-dbg/xenial 16.04ubuntu2 amd64
kubuntu-desktop/xenial 1.338 amd64
kubuntu-docs/xenial,xenial 15.04ubuntu2 all
kubuntu-driver-manager/xenial 15.10ubuntu3 amd64
kubuntu-driver-manager-dbg/xenial 15.10ubuntu3 amd64
kubuntu-full/xenial 1.338 amd64
kubuntu-notification-helper/xenial 15.10ubuntu2 amd64
kubuntu-notification-helper-dbg/xenial 15.10ubuntu2 amd64
kubuntu-patched-l10n/xenial,xenial 14.04ubuntu1 all
kubuntu-restricted-addons/xenial 23 amd64
kubuntu-restricted-extras/xenial 65 amd64
kubuntu-settings-desktop/xenial,xenial 1:16.04ubuntu2 all
kubuntu-web-shortcuts/xenial,xenial 15.04ubuntu1 all
ldm-kubuntu-theme/xenial,xenial 2:2.0.47 all
libkubuntu-dbg/xenial 15.04ubuntu2 amd64
libkubuntu-dev/xenial 15.04ubuntu2 amd64
libkubuntu1/xenial 15.04ubuntu2 amd64
plymouth-theme-kubuntu-logo/xenial,xenial 1:16.04ubuntu2 all
plymouth-theme-kubuntu-text/xenial,xenial 1:16.04ubuntu2 all
ubiquity-slideshow-kubuntu/xenial-updates,xenial-updates 113.1 all

Regards,
Ralf


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Re: Kubuntu 18.04.2 LTS -> Ubuntu 19.04

rikona
In reply to this post by Colin Watson
On Sun, 16 Jun 2019 13:32:15 +0100
Colin Watson <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Put differently: the Ubuntu Desktop images don't contain KDE, but an
> installed Ubuntu Desktop system can install KDE-based packages just as
> an installed Kubuntu system can.  Many Ubuntu Desktop users use the
> odd KDE-based package, just as they use any of a wide variety of other
> packages that aren't actually part of the base installation.

Just a comment... I rather like some KDE pgms and have been using them
in Ubuntu for a few versions now [currently in 16.04]. Some, like k3b,
work perfectly, others, like konqueror, work quite well - enough to
still be very useful. There are some odd behaviors, like copy/paste not
always working. If you don't mind a few odd behaviors this might be one
way to go - just install the pgms you want to use. It will install a
lot of stuff to support these pgms, but with todays large disks this is
perhaps not a problem.

Rik

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Re: Kubuntu 18.04.2 LTS -> Ubuntu 19.04

Volker Wysk
In reply to this post by ubuntu-users mailing list
Am Sonntag, den 16.06.2019, 14:41 +0200 schrieb Ralf Mardorf via
ubuntu-users:

> On Sun, 16 Jun 2019 14:16:42 +0200, Volker Wysk wrote:
> > What I'm not sure about: Is a KDE version contained in Ubuntu (no
> > "K"),
> > or is it only in Kubuntu?
>
> Hi,
>
> I'm not on 19.04. However, regarding the package search at least
> the meta-packages are provided, for 19.04, too.
>
> kubuntu-desktop is a hard dependency of kubuntu-full
>
> https://packages.ubuntu.com/disco/kubuntu-full
>
> https://packages.ubuntu.com/disco/kubuntu-desktop
>
> you might want to install one of those meta-packages.
>
> Likely 19.04 also provides the tasks. I don't know if it makes a
> difference, if you install a task or a meta-package. AFAIK by
> installing the meta-package, you automatically install the task,
> since
> tasksel is installed by default and IIUC if it is installed, then apt
> automatically installs the task.
>
> You don't need to add a PPA to get the regular Kubuntu packages,
> since
> thy are provided by the official "universe" repository.
>
> [weremouse@moonstudio ~]$ lsb_release -d
> Description: Ubuntu 16.04.6 LTS
> [weremouse@moonstudio ~]$ tasksel --list-task | grep kubu
> u kubuntu-live Kubuntu live CD
> u kubuntu-desktop Kubuntu desktop
> u kubuntu-full Kubuntu full
> [weremouse@moonstudio ~]$ apt list '*kubu*'
> Listing... Done
> kubuntu-active/xenial 1.338 amd64
> kubuntu-debug-installer/xenial 16.04ubuntu2 amd64
> kubuntu-debug-installer-dbg/xenial 16.04ubuntu2 amd64
> kubuntu-desktop/xenial 1.338 amd64
> kubuntu-docs/xenial,xenial 15.04ubuntu2 all
> kubuntu-driver-manager/xenial 15.10ubuntu3 amd64
> kubuntu-driver-manager-dbg/xenial 15.10ubuntu3 amd64
> kubuntu-full/xenial 1.338 amd64
> kubuntu-notification-helper/xenial 15.10ubuntu2 amd64
> kubuntu-notification-helper-dbg/xenial 15.10ubuntu2 amd64
> kubuntu-patched-l10n/xenial,xenial 14.04ubuntu1 all
> kubuntu-restricted-addons/xenial 23 amd64
> kubuntu-restricted-extras/xenial 65 amd64
> kubuntu-settings-desktop/xenial,xenial 1:16.04ubuntu2 all
> kubuntu-web-shortcuts/xenial,xenial 15.04ubuntu1 all
> ldm-kubuntu-theme/xenial,xenial 2:2.0.47 all
> libkubuntu-dbg/xenial 15.04ubuntu2 amd64
> libkubuntu-dev/xenial 15.04ubuntu2 amd64
> libkubuntu1/xenial 15.04ubuntu2 amd64
> plymouth-theme-kubuntu-logo/xenial,xenial 1:16.04ubuntu2 all
> plymouth-theme-kubuntu-text/xenial,xenial 1:16.04ubuntu2 all
> ubiquity-slideshow-kubuntu/xenial-updates,xenial-updates 113.1 all

This looks good. I guess I'll set up a new 19.04 vanilla-Ubuntu system,
using both the provided Gnome and KDE versions. I won't setup any new
Kubuntu-PPAs.

For my regular work I'll use Gnome (which I've alread come to like) and
some KDE programs, such as K3b, Kdenlive, Konqueror, Amarok.

Cheers
Volker


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Re: Kubuntu 18.04.2 LTS -> Ubuntu 19.04

Liam Proven
In reply to this post by Volker Wysk
On Sun, 16 Jun 2019 at 14:19, Volker Wysk <[hidden email]> wrote:

> I've been a KDE user for many years, but I've finally come to the
> conclusion that it's - still! - too buggy and unstable. I finally want
> a system that "just works". I don't want to spend my time fighting with
> bugs.

I started using desktop Linux when KDE came out. I was a big fan of
KDE 1, got on all right with KDE 2, found KDE 3 too bloated and KDE 4
totally unusable. KDE 5 is marginally better than 4 but not
significantly, for me.

In other words: Linux is Linux. Desktops are what they are. They're
_all_ buggy, _all_ unstable to some degree.

If you move to another expecting stability, you *will* be disappointed.

KDE is the most mature Linux desktop there is.

Pretty much the _least_ stable is GNOME, where with v3 they dumped the
entire, mature, well-loved by everyone, even used in Solaris, GNOME 3
and started over with a poorly-planned, designed-by-committee new
look.

It would be the _last_ I recommend. Seriously. And I've tried them all
over 23 years working with Linux.

> Just take a look at the kdepim-users mailing list...

Don't confuse the desktop with the bundled apps.

Problems with  the apps? Then don't use them.

It is significant that many distros' KDE versions don't use the KDE
apps and replace them with Firefox, Thunderbird, LibreOffice, etc.
Why? Because they are Linux best-of-breed.

KDE lost the battle to GNOME 2.

The GNOME project decided to throw all that goodwill away.

So I never recommend it.

Secondly, if you're planning to go from LTS + mature desktop to
short-term PLUS unstable desktop, you are _not_ going to be pleased
with the stability of the result.

> It's a pity, since I think KDE is really good, feature-wise. If it just
> worked...

Good for you. I can't stand it myself but that's just me. I want
vertical taskbars and KDE can't do them well.

If you want the most stable, slowest-changing, most reliable desktop,
then try Xfce.

It's what I use now that Unity is basically dead.

And Xfce is the same in LTS and short-term releases so you miss nothing.

And it can be configured to look just like KDE, unlike GNOME 3.

> I've read somewhere that Gnome is released half-year wise, just like
> Ubuntu. So (I think), the latest Ubuntu version always contains the
> latest Gnome version.

It is an this is why Ubuntu has a 6mth release cycle.

You realise this is the opposite of stable and reliable, right?

> As I've written: I want do switch to Gnome.
>
> I've used Gnome for some week now, and it *just works*.

I submit you've not had time to feel the pain yet.

> > Are you running a separate /home filesystem?
>
> No.
>
> >
> > You should.
> >
> > If you do, you can dual boot them & share a home directory between
> > Kubuntu and Ubuntu GNOME.
>
> It's perfectly possible to run Gnome and KDE side-by-side in the same
> system. That's what I'me doing right now. No dual boot necessary.

You miss my point.

You could share it between LTS+KDE and short-term+GNOME/Xfce/whatever.


> I think I will take the trouble and setup a new, clean Ubuntu 19.04.
>
> What I'm not sure about: Is a KDE version contained in Ubuntu (no "K"),
> or is it only in Kubuntu? I don't want to give it up completely. At
> least there are some KDE programs which I want to keep using.

The Ubuntu repos contain all the desktops used by all the remixes, and
several more which are not the default for any remix.

> I guess I could use the Kubuntu PPAs in order to get Kubuntu programs
> in Ubuntu, but is this supported?

You don't need to. There is only one set of standard Ubuntu repos.
Everything for all desktops is in there.

I think your reasoning as discussed here is flawed and I would urge
you to reconsider. I think you're letting yourself in for a world of
pain, with more of the problems you say that you want to get away
from: instability, bugginess, etc.


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Re: Kubuntu 18.04.2 LTS -> Ubuntu 19.04

Colin Law
In reply to this post by Volker Wysk
On Sun, 16 Jun 2019 at 13:19, Volker Wysk <[hidden email]> wrote:
> ...
> It's perfectly possible to run Gnome and KDE side-by-side in the same
> system. That's what I'me doing right now. No dual boot necessary.

If you are already doing it I don't understand what this thread is all
about.  Why not just carry on as you are?

Colin

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Re: Kubuntu 18.04.2 LTS -> Ubuntu 19.04

Liam Proven
On Mon, 17 Jun 2019 at 16:45, Colin Law <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> If you are already doing it I don't understand what this thread is all
> about.  Why not just carry on as you are?

Well, quite!

In order to get the latest-and-greatest version, I guess.

I sort of understand this, but it's why I run openSUSE Tumbleweed at
work. It's a rolling-release distro but with extensive automated
testing, unlike Debian Sid or Fedora Rawhide. Easier and stabler than
Arch, too.

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