Line wrapping for smart phones - Was: 18.04 LTS installation failure

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Line wrapping for smart phones - Was: 18.04 LTS installation failure

ubuntu-users mailing list
On Mon, 10 Jun 2019 11:50:20 +0200, Liam Proven wrote:
>All right, Ralf, we get it and I agree, but you are getting a little
>carried away here. :-)  

If somebody should be interested, there's a thread at
https://lists.claws-mail.org/pipermail/users/2019-June/024247.html.

Somebody already posted a screenshot of a smart phone text, that is
broken due to line wrapping at 72 chars. Smart phone users expect all
other computer users to resize windows to wrap lines, which not
necessarily does the job, usually it's required to side scroll, while
they simply could rotate the text or don't use a smart phone at all.

My bank replied to my complain related to the new online banking web
site, that became unclear, that it now could be used with a smart phone.
Are people using smart phones in their home offices? Are people doing
banking in the streets? Why don't they use a tablet computer, if they
want a portable device?

What next? Carpenters using a smart phones to nail?
Shouldn't carpenters continue using hammers or nailguns instead of
smart phones?


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Re: Line wrapping for smart phones - Was: 18.04 LTS installation failure

Liam Proven
On Mon, 10 Jun 2019 at 14:10, Ralf Mardorf via ubuntu-users
<[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> If somebody should be interested, there's a thread at
> https://lists.claws-mail.org/pipermail/users/2019-June/024247.html.

This debate came up on the ClassicCmp mailing lists a couple of years
ago. I was very surprised that people _wanted_ hard line wrapping. I
do not want it myself and I regard myself as a strong "email
traditionalist".

> Somebody already posted a screenshot of a smart phone text, that is
> broken due to line wrapping at 72 chars. Smart phone users expect all
> other computer users to resize windows to wrap lines, which not
> necessarily does the job, usually it's required to side scroll, while
> they simply could rotate the text or don't use a smart phone at all.

Yes, I thought unwrapped would be more useful and flexible. But
apparently many old mail clients can't wrap text on their own. I did
not know this. The ones I used in the 1980s and early 1990s could. (I
have an email archive of all my mail back to 1993. Sadly I lost the
first 2 years on the CIX account in my signature, which is now 28
years old.)


> My bank replied to my complain related to the new online banking web
> site, that became unclear, that it now could be used with a smart phone.

So?

> Are people using smart phones in their home offices?

Yes.

> Are people doing
> banking in the streets?

Yes.

> Why don't they use a tablet computer, if they
> want a portable device?

That means they need 2 devices. For about a billion people, especially
in Asia, their smartphone *is* their computer.

You know that in recent years, PC sales are well under 100 million
units a year? About 69 million last year. A year or 2 earlier, 88
million.

Smartphones sell 1.5 *billion* a year.

The entire PC market is a tiny rounding error on the smartphone market.

> What next? Carpenters using a smart phones to nail?

Cellphones already replaced landlines, PCs, laptops and tablets for
most people. In much of Africa there is no landline phone network or
cabled internet; there are only mobile networks and backhaul for the
mobile masts, nothing else.

On my team at $DAYJOB I have a colleague in Washington State USA. Not
far from the HQ of Microsoft.

She uses a satellite dish for Internet. She can't get wired internet.
This is normal.

> Shouldn't carpenters continue using hammers or nailguns instead of
> smart phones?

Smartphones are computers. For most people, today, they are their only
computers. Nearly half the human race is not online yet. For them,
smartphones will be the only computers they ever know.

This is why it is so very tragic that Ubuntu killed its
smartphone/tablet product.

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Re: Line wrapping for smart phones - Was: 18.04 LTS installation failure

ubuntu-users mailing list
On Mon, 10 Jun 2019 14:24:32 +0200, Liam Proven wrote:

>> Somebody already posted a screenshot of a smart phone text, that is
>> broken due to line wrapping at 72 chars. Smart phone users expect all
>> other computer users to resize windows to wrap lines, which not
>> necessarily does the job, usually it's required to side scroll, while
>> they simply could rotate the text or don't use a smart phone at
>> all.  
>
>Yes, I thought unwrapped would be more useful and flexible. But
>apparently many old mail clients can't wrap text on their own. I did
>not know this. The ones I used in the 1980s and early 1990s could. (I
>have an email archive of all my mail back to 1993. Sadly I lost the
>first 2 years on the CIX account in my signature, which is now 28
>years old.)

Good point!

https://lists.claws-mail.org/pipermail/users/2019-June/024264.html


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Re: Line wrapping for smart phones - Was: 18.04 LTS installation failure

Bret Busby-2
In reply to this post by Liam Proven
On 10/06/2019, Liam Proven <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On Mon, 10 Jun 2019 at 14:10, Ralf Mardorf via ubuntu-users
> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> If somebody should be interested, there's a thread at
>> https://lists.claws-mail.org/pipermail/users/2019-June/024247.html.
>
> This debate came up on the ClassicCmp mailing lists a couple of years
> ago. I was very surprised that people _wanted_ hard line wrapping. I
> do not want it myself and I regard myself as a strong "email
> traditionalist".
>
>> Somebody already posted a screenshot of a smart phone text, that is
>> broken due to line wrapping at 72 chars. Smart phone users expect all
>> other computer users to resize windows to wrap lines, which not
>> necessarily does the job, usually it's required to side scroll, while
>> they simply could rotate the text or don't use a smart phone at all.
>
> Yes, I thought unwrapped would be more useful and flexible. But
> apparently many old mail clients can't wrap text on their own. I did
> not know this. The ones I used in the 1980s and early 1990s could.

Interesting, because "the 1980s and early 1990s" is before "The
Internet" - at that time, internets operated generally through
ARPAnet, from memory, unless they were standalone internets.

--
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West Australia
..............

"So once you do know what the question actually is,
 you'll know what the answer means."
- Deep Thought,
 Chapter 28 of Book 1 of
 "The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy:
 A Trilogy In Four Parts",
 written by Douglas Adams,
 published by Pan Books, 1992

....................................................

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Re: Line wrapping for smart phones - Was: 18.04 LTS installation failure

Wade Smart-2
On Mon, Jun 10, 2019 at 11:10 AM Bret Busby <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Interesting, because "the 1980s and early 1990s" is before "The
> Internet" - at that time, internets operated generally through
> ARPAnet, from memory, unless they were standalone internets.
>

Sure there was email in the 80's. What wasnt said was it was
sent over the "internet".

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Re: Line wrapping for smart phones - Was: 18.04 LTS installation failure

Bret Busby-2
In reply to this post by Bret Busby-2
On 11/06/2019, Bret Busby <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On 10/06/2019, Liam Proven <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> On Mon, 10 Jun 2019 at 14:10, Ralf Mardorf via ubuntu-users
>> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
>>> If somebody should be interested, there's a thread at
>>> https://lists.claws-mail.org/pipermail/users/2019-June/024247.html.
>>
>> This debate came up on the ClassicCmp mailing lists a couple of years
>> ago. I was very surprised that people _wanted_ hard line wrapping. I
>> do not want it myself and I regard myself as a strong "email
>> traditionalist".
>>
>>> Somebody already posted a screenshot of a smart phone text, that is
>>> broken due to line wrapping at 72 chars. Smart phone users expect all
>>> other computer users to resize windows to wrap lines, which not
>>> necessarily does the job, usually it's required to side scroll, while
>>> they simply could rotate the text or don't use a smart phone at all.
>>
>> Yes, I thought unwrapped would be more useful and flexible. But
>> apparently many old mail clients can't wrap text on their own. I did
>> not know this. The ones I used in the 1980s and early 1990s could.
>
> Interesting, because "the 1980s and early 1990s" is before "The
> Internet" - at that time, internets operated generally through
> ARPAnet, from memory, unless they were standalone internets.
>

And, from memory, the main (if not the only) cross-platform email
clients, from that time, were pine and elm.

I still use the son of pine; alpine, and I had used pine, until it was
no longer supported.

--
Bret Busby
Armadale
West Australia
..............

"So once you do know what the question actually is,
 you'll know what the answer means."
- Deep Thought,
 Chapter 28 of Book 1 of
 "The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy:
 A Trilogy In Four Parts",
 written by Douglas Adams,
 published by Pan Books, 1992

....................................................

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Re: Line wrapping for smart phones - Was: 18.04 LTS installation failure

ubuntu-users mailing list
In reply to this post by Liam Proven
On Mon, 10 Jun 2019 14:24:32 +0200, Liam Proven wrote:
>
> You know that in recent years, PC sales are well under 100 million
> units a year? About 69 million last year. A year or 2 earlier, 88
> million.
>
> Smartphones sell 1.5 *billion* a year.

cite?

heh...  Well, folks are less likely to flush PCs down the toilet, snap
them in half in their butt pocket, leave them at TSA security, or drop
them while doing stoopid selfies on cliffs.  A lot of the sales number
must be _replacement_ phones.

Tho', there have been a time or two when I wanted to flush a Windows PC
down the toilet....

Jonesy
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Re: Line wrapping for smart phones - Was: 18.04 LTS installation failure

Wade Smart-2
> heh...  Well, folks are less likely to flush PCs down the toilet, snap
> them in half in their butt pocket, leave them at TSA security, or drop
> them while doing stoopid selfies on cliffs.  A lot of the sales number
> must be _replacement_ phones.
>
> Tho', there have been a time or two when I wanted to flush a Windows PC
> down the toilet....

There are a lot of phones but there are also a lot of people on their
phones doing nothing. One can post that pc sales have slowed down
but are never going to write code, design sites, software, project management,
handle large data sets, graphic design, etc, on a phone.

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Re: Line wrapping for smart phones - Was: 18.04 LTS installation failure

ubuntu-users mailing list
In reply to this post by ubuntu-users mailing list
On Mon, 10 Jun 2019 16:23:02 -0000 (UTC), Jonesy via ubuntu-users wrote:
>Tho', there have been a time or two when I wanted to flush a Windows
>PC down the toilet....

A friend tossed one out of the window, but it didn't solve the issue
for the long haul. The replacement Windows PC started misbehaving after
a while, too. I run Windows as a guest on my Linux PC, if it starts
making trouble I usually restore from a backup, sometimes restoring
from a snapshot already does the job, but since VBox has got it's
pitfalls, too, I usually connect a backup drive and spend a quarter of
an hour to get everything back from an USB drive. My backup drives
provide e-SATA, but my Linux PC doesn't.


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Re: Line wrapping for smart phones - Was: 18.04 LTS installation failure

Wade Smart-2
On Mon, Jun 10, 2019 at 11:41 AM Ralf Mardorf via ubuntu-users
<[hidden email]> wrote:
My backup drives
> provide e-SATA, but my Linux PC doesn't.

I wish e-sata had caught on more.

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Re: Line wrapping for smart phones - Was: 18.04 LTS installation failure

Little Girl
In reply to this post by Bret Busby-2
Hey there,

Bret Busby wrote:

>And, from memory, the main (if not the only) cross-platform email
>clients, from that time, were pine and elm.

There was also Silly Little Mail Reader (SLMR) back in the BBS days.

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Re: Line wrapping for smart phones - Was: 18.04 LTS installation failure

Liam Proven
In reply to this post by Bret Busby-2
On Mon, 10 Jun 2019 at 18:10, Bret Busby <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Interesting, because "the 1980s and early 1990s" is before "The
> Internet" - at that time, internets operated generally through
> ARPAnet, from memory, unless they were standalone internets.

Not even slightly, no.

The email address in my sig -- [hidden email] -- is hosted by CIX:
https://www.cix.uk/

Part of the reason I've kept it is that to the cognoscenti, a
cix.co.uk email address means you were old-school and were online
before the trendy public WWW came along. Few recognise it now but if
they do, the reaction is "whoah, this person has been online for
30-something years!"

Which I have.

I joined in November 1991. I have friends on there who joined when it
opened up for public subs in 1987.

On its boards, Cliff Stanford --
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cliff_Stanford -- was discussing his
idea for a public ISP in a conference called cix:tenner_a_month. I was
in there. It became Demon Internet:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demon_Internet

CIX didn't give you a routed connection over dial-up in the '80s but
you could send and receive Internet mail, ftp files, access Usenet and
so on. You could also do ftp by email which was handy. You told a
batch server what files you wanted from where; it FTPed them to your
private space; then it emailed you when they were done; you logged in
and downloaded them direct from CIX's servers.

Before that, I did have PPP via CIS, AKA Compu$erve; I was 100277,414
or [hidden email]

But before Demon you could buy dial-up from PIPEX in the UK:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pipex

Before that, I was on JANET via Royal Holloway University. I was
sending and receiving Internet email from 1985 on their cluster of 2
DEC VAX-11/780 machines.

The *Web* is a 1990s thing, but the Internet was around for public use
for a decade before that.

In the 1970s it was confined to universities and the military. Not by the 1980s.

I wasn't on it myself (because local phone calls cost money in Europe)
but many FidoNet BBSs were on the Internet in the late 1980s and you
could send and receive Internet emails through them.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FidoNet

CIX was inspired by, and ran the same host software, as BIX in the States:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Byte_Information_Exchange

I had friends on that. Others used, and still use,  the Well, the
Whole Earth 'Lectronic Link:

https://www.well.com/

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Re: Line wrapping for smart phones - Was: 18.04 LTS installation failure

Liam Proven
In reply to this post by Bret Busby-2
On Mon, 10 Jun 2019 at 18:20, Bret Busby <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> And, from memory, the main (if not the only) cross-platform email
> clients, from that time, were pine and elm.
>
> I still use the son of pine; alpine, and I had used pine, until it was
> no longer supported.

I didn't need it to be cross-platform, so I used an MS-DOS one called
Matrix. It is mentioned here:

https://www.cix.uk/contact/about

Then I switched to Ameol, as mentioned here:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CIX

At work, I had an account on our DEC ALL-IN-1 system.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ALL-IN-1

By 1995 I maintained PC-Pro magazine's email gateway, running on NT
Server 3.51 using a commercial gateway from POP3/SMTP to Microsoft
Mail, which goes back to 1988.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Mail

So, no, this stuff is older than you think!

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Re: Line wrapping for smart phones - Was: 18.04 LTS installation failure

Liam Proven
In reply to this post by ubuntu-users mailing list
On Mon, 10 Jun 2019 at 18:24, Jonesy via ubuntu-users
<[hidden email]> wrote:

>
> On Mon, 10 Jun 2019 14:24:32 +0200, Liam Proven wrote:
> >
> > You know that in recent years, PC sales are well under 100 million
> > units a year? About 69 million last year. A year or 2 earlier, 88
> > million.
> >
> > Smartphones sell 1.5 *billion* a year.
>
> cite?

I meant to, actually. Sorry about that.

https://www.gartner.com/en/newsroom/press-releases/2019-01-10-gartner-says-worldwide-pc-shipments-declined-4-3-perc

PC Sales: 68.6 million last year.

https://www.digitaltrends.com/mobile/2018-smartphone-sales-decline-news/

1.43 billion smartphones last year.
1.51 billion in 2017.




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Re: Line wrapping for smart phones - Was: 18.04 LTS installation failure

Bret Busby-2
In reply to this post by Liam Proven
On 11/06/2019, Liam Proven <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On Mon, 10 Jun 2019 at 18:10, Bret Busby <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> Interesting, because "the 1980s and early 1990s" is before "The
>> Internet" - at that time, internets operated generally through
>> ARPAnet, from memory, unless they were standalone internets.
>
> Not even slightly, no.
>
> The email address in my sig -- [hidden email] -- is hosted by CIX:
> https://www.cix.uk/
>
> Part of the reason I've kept it is that to the cognoscenti, a
> cix.co.uk email address means you were old-school and were online
> before the trendy public WWW came along. Few recognise it now but if
> they do, the reaction is "whoah, this person has been online for
> 30-something years!"
>
> Which I have.
>
> I joined in November 1991. I have friends on there who joined when it
> opened up for public subs in 1987.
>
> On its boards, Cliff Stanford --
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cliff_Stanford -- was discussing his
> idea for a public ISP in a conference called cix:tenner_a_month. I was
> in there. It became Demon Internet:
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demon_Internet
>
> CIX didn't give you a routed connection over dial-up in the '80s but
> you could send and receive Internet mail, ftp files, access Usenet and
> so on. You could also do ftp by email which was handy. You told a
> batch server what files you wanted from where; it FTPed them to your
> private space; then it emailed you when they were done; you logged in
> and downloaded them direct from CIX's servers.
>
> Before that, I did have PPP via CIS, AKA Compu$erve; I was 100277,414
> or [hidden email]
>
> But before Demon you could buy dial-up from PIPEX in the UK:
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pipex
>
> Before that, I was on JANET via Royal Holloway University. I was
> sending and receiving Internet email from 1985 on their cluster of 2
> DEC VAX-11/780 machines.
>
> The *Web* is a 1990s thing, but the Internet was around for public use
> for a decade before that.
>
> In the 1970s it was confined to universities and the military. Not by the
> 1980s.
>
> I wasn't on it myself (because local phone calls cost money in Europe)
> but many FidoNet BBSs were on the Internet in the late 1980s and you
> could send and receive Internet emails through them.
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FidoNet
>
> CIX was inspired by, and ran the same host software, as BIX in the States:
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Byte_Information_Exchange
>
> I had friends on that. Others used, and still use,  the Well, the
> Whole Earth 'Lectronic Link:
>
> https://www.well.com/
>

I suppose that it comes to the question of locality.

In Western Australia, in the early 1990's, at one of the universities,
access to other networks was via AARnet, the Australian Academic and
Research network, which was a node of ARPAnet. In the state capital, a
man ran a service, with flyers at one or more of the universities,
where he somehow acted as a node on the AARnet, and provided a UNIX
email account on his server, and, free access to his UNIX system, so
that students could learn UNIX as users, which is probably how he was
able to have a node on the AARnet. That was a thing of wonder, and,
his offering was the only internetworking (as in what internetworking
means - communication between computers of different operating systems
platforms), that was available to "the public" of which I was aware at
the time.

In the early 1990's, the Internet was neither accessible in Western
Australia, nor, mentioned or taught, in one or more universities and
technical colleges in Western Australia.

But, then, in the 1990's, the FORTRAN that was being taught in Western
Australian academic institutions and technical colleges, was FORTRAN
77.

It is probably not surprising, in a country that is determined to go
backward, with wired Internet access having been forcibly changed to
the reliability of overhead, uninsulated, copper telephone wires -
sometimes it works, and, sometimes it doesn't, with about a 50%
success rate.

So, while the Internet may have been active elsewhere in the world,
the sailing ships carrying the bytes, had yet to reach Australia.

I suppose it is a bit like the countries that have Internet data
transmission speeds at and above the 1GB/s mark - in Australia, when
access is available to the Internet, achieving a speed over 50MB/s, is
regarded like the first landing on the moon.

--
Bret Busby
Armadale
West Australia
.............

"So once you do know what the question actually is,
 you'll know what the answer means."
- Deep Thought,
 Chapter 28 of Book 1 of
 "The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy:
 A Trilogy In Four Parts",
 written by Douglas Adams,
 published by Pan Books, 1992

....................................................

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Re: Line wrapping for smart phones - Was: 18.04 LTS installation failure

Bret Busby-2
On 11/06/2019, Bret Busby <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On 11/06/2019, Liam Proven <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> On Mon, 10 Jun 2019 at 18:10, Bret Busby <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
>>> Interesting, because "the 1980s and early 1990s" is before "The
>>> Internet" - at that time, internets operated generally through
>>> ARPAnet, from memory, unless they were standalone internets.
>>
>> Not even slightly, no.
>>
>> The email address in my sig -- [hidden email] -- is hosted by CIX:
>> https://www.cix.uk/
>>
>> Part of the reason I've kept it is that to the cognoscenti, a
>> cix.co.uk email address means you were old-school and were online
>> before the trendy public WWW came along. Few recognise it now but if
>> they do, the reaction is "whoah, this person has been online for
>> 30-something years!"
>>
>> Which I have.
>>
>> I joined in November 1991. I have friends on there who joined when it
>> opened up for public subs in 1987.
>>
>> On its boards, Cliff Stanford --
>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cliff_Stanford -- was discussing his
>> idea for a public ISP in a conference called cix:tenner_a_month. I was
>> in there. It became Demon Internet:
>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demon_Internet
>>
>> CIX didn't give you a routed connection over dial-up in the '80s but
>> you could send and receive Internet mail, ftp files, access Usenet and
>> so on. You could also do ftp by email which was handy. You told a
>> batch server what files you wanted from where; it FTPed them to your
>> private space; then it emailed you when they were done; you logged in
>> and downloaded them direct from CIX's servers.
>>
>> Before that, I did have PPP via CIS, AKA Compu$erve; I was 100277,414
>> or [hidden email]
>>
>> But before Demon you could buy dial-up from PIPEX in the UK:
>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pipex
>>
>> Before that, I was on JANET via Royal Holloway University. I was
>> sending and receiving Internet email from 1985 on their cluster of 2
>> DEC VAX-11/780 machines.
>>
>> The *Web* is a 1990s thing, but the Internet was around for public use
>> for a decade before that.
>>
>> In the 1970s it was confined to universities and the military. Not by the
>> 1980s.
>>
>> I wasn't on it myself (because local phone calls cost money in Europe)
>> but many FidoNet BBSs were on the Internet in the late 1980s and you
>> could send and receive Internet emails through them.
>>
>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FidoNet
>>
>> CIX was inspired by, and ran the same host software, as BIX in the
>> States:
>>
>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Byte_Information_Exchange
>>
>> I had friends on that. Others used, and still use,  the Well, the
>> Whole Earth 'Lectronic Link:
>>
>> https://www.well.com/
>>
>
> I suppose that it comes to the question of locality.
>
> In Western Australia, in the early 1990's, at one of the universities,
> access to other networks was via AARnet, the Australian Academic and
> Research network, which was a node of ARPAnet. In the state capital, a
> man ran a service, with flyers at one or more of the universities,
> where he somehow acted as a node on the AARnet, and provided a UNIX
> email account on his server, and, free access to his UNIX system, so
> that students could learn UNIX as users, which is probably how he was
> able to have a node on the AARnet. That was a thing of wonder, and,
> his offering was the only internetworking (as in what internetworking
> means - communication between computers of different operating systems
> platforms), that was available to "the public" of which I was aware at
> the time.
>
> In the early 1990's, the Internet was neither accessible in Western
> Australia, nor, mentioned or taught, in one or more universities and
> technical colleges in Western Australia.
>
> But, then, in the 1990's, the FORTRAN that was being taught in Western
> Australian academic institutions and technical colleges, was FORTRAN
> 77.
>
> It is probably not surprising, in a country that is determined to go
> backward, with wired Internet access having been forcibly changed to
> the reliability of overhead, uninsulated, copper telephone wires -
> sometimes it works, and, sometimes it doesn't, with about a 50%
> success rate.
>
> So, while the Internet may have been active elsewhere in the world,
> the sailing ships carrying the bytes, had yet to reach Australia.
>
> I suppose it is a bit like the countries that have Internet data
> transmission speeds at and above the 1GB/s mark - in Australia, when
> access is available to the Internet, achieving a speed over 50MB/s, is
> regarded like the first landing on the moon.
>

That last part should have been

"
in Australia, when wired access is actually available to the Internet,
achieving a speed over 50MB/s, is regarded like the first landing on
the moon was, at the time that it happened.
"

--
Bret Busby
Armadale
West Australia
..............

"So once you do know what the question actually is,
 you'll know what the answer means."
- Deep Thought,
 Chapter 28 of Book 1 of
 "The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy:
 A Trilogy In Four Parts",
 written by Douglas Adams,
 published by Pan Books, 1992

....................................................

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Re: Line wrapping for smart phones - Was: 18.04 LTS installation failure

ubuntu-users mailing list
In reply to this post by Liam Proven
My closing statement:

https://lists.claws-mail.org/pipermail/users/2019-June/024277.html

While the Budgie desktop environment already dropped important desktop
environment features, to fake an iOS alike user interface, I fear that
the next generation of desktop environments migrate to a smart watch
user interface approach. Funny enough that applications on iOS devices
sometimes provide features, that desktop computer environments, such as
Budgie, don't provide anymore. Also funny that the GNOME MUA Evolution
has got a menu bar :).


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Re: Line wrapping for smart phones - Was: 18.04 LTS installation failure

Liam Proven
In reply to this post by Bret Busby-2
On Mon, 10 Jun 2019 at 20:41, Bret Busby <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> I suppose that it comes to the question of locality.

I lived on the Isle of Man until 1992. It's a lot smaller, relatively
speaking a lot more crowded, but also relatively speaking just about
as isolated.

I used to read stories from people in the US and envy their superior
connectivity.

But I'd say it went something like...

* early 1980s -- BBSs become common on mid-era 8-bit computers (mainly in US)
* mid-'80s -- many BBSs federate for message-passing, big ones get
Internet connections
* late '80s -- serious professional users or rich geeks are buying
dialup accounts partly for access to Usenet etc.
* early 1990s -- some of the biggest online services (e.g. CI$) start
allowing PPP
* mid '90s -- most geeks are buying dial-up PPP & using it for email,
ftp, usenet, chat
* late '90s -- you're not a geek if you're not online; early adopters
are getting ADSL broadband
* turn of the century -- dialup usage dropping fast; some OSes more or
less assume broadband, e.g. for updates
* early "noughties" (2001-2004 ish) -- dialup all but dead. Early
adopters are on megabit+ and adopting wifi
* mid-noughties: wired internet is becoming passé

I started working in IT in 1988. We had a *synchronous* modem
connection (not RS232 or anything like that!) to an IBM support
service for product patches. It was EXPEN$IVE and we didn't use it a
lot. No email or online contact to the business.

2nd job, 1991. I got my own dial-up account and permanent personal
email. Some others were doing the same.

3rd job, 1992. Most young techies had an email address.

4th job, 1993. I bought my employer its own domain name. We had
intra-company email but only inside regional offices. Trans-Atlantic
comms used Compu$erve occasionally. We had X.25 that we didn't use,
but branch-to-HQ data was over redundant leased lines, over DECnet.

5th job, 1995. We had company-wide email & I put in an Internet gateway for it.

Went freelance, 1996. Started putting in company-wide dial-on-demand
proxy servers for clients; web access on the desktop & 1 company email
address was common, hi-tech companies had individual employee emails.

--
Liam Proven - Profile: https://about.me/liamproven
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RE: Line wrapping for smart phones - Was: 18.04 LTS installation failure

J.Witvliet
In reply to this post by Bret Busby-2
You're missing some lines...

-----Original Message-----

* early "noughties" (2001-2004 ish) -- dialup all but dead. Early
adopters are on megabit+ and adopting wifi
* mid-noughties: wired internet is becoming passé

** tennies (2010-2019)
Wifi clogged up (too many users) and unreliable
4G delivers promised latency & bandwidth only at "demo-locations", and, at a price.
5G got nicked-named: spy-net
Wired (not only fiber) delivers 200Mb and higher

Dit bericht kan informatie bevatten die niet voor u is bestemd. Indien u niet de geadresseerde bent of dit bericht abusievelijk aan u is toegezonden, wordt u verzocht dat aan de afzender te melden en het bericht te verwijderen. De Staat aanvaardt geen aansprakelijkheid voor schade, van welke aard ook, die verband houdt met risico's verbonden aan het elektronisch verzenden van berichten.

This message may contain information that is not intended for you. If you are not the addressee or if this message was sent to you by mistake, you are requested to inform the sender and delete the message. The State accepts no liability for damage of any kind resulting from the risks inherent in the electronic transmission of messages.
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Re: Line wrapping for smart phones - Was: 18.04 LTS installation failure

ubuntu-users mailing list
In reply to this post by Wade Smart-2
On Mon, 10 Jun 2019 11:28:38 -0500, Wade Smart wrote:

>> heh...  Well, folks are less likely to flush PCs down the toilet,
>> snap them in half in their butt pocket, leave them at TSA security,
>> or drop them while doing stoopid selfies on cliffs.  A lot of the
>> sales number must be _replacement_ phones.
>>
>> Tho', there have been a time or two when I wanted to flush a Windows
>> PC down the toilet....  
>
>There are a lot of phones but there are also a lot of people on their
>phones doing nothing. One can post that pc sales have slowed down
>but are never going to write code, design sites, software, project
>management, handle large data sets, graphic design, etc, on a phone.

FWIW I don't buy a complete computer, I replace parts of my computer.
If I buy a new mobo and a new CPU, I call it a new computer.

Sustainability related to computers might not be worth a statistic.
However, the EU and German government fake a lot to care about
ecological footprints. Banning plastic bags on a continent were
everybody is in favour of a rucksack ("Rucksack" is a German word, older
than the samrt phone ;) gains nothing. Is anybody thinking about a
smart phone's lifespan?

--
"Always that same LSD story, you've all seen it. 'Young man on acid,
thought he could fly, jumped out of a building. What a tragedy.' What a
dick! Fuck him, he’s an idiot. If he thought he could fly, why didn’t
he take off on the ground first? Check it out. You don’t see ducks
lined up to catch elevators to fly south—they fly from the ground" -
Bill Hicks


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