Problem reinstalling Xubuntu 16.04

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Problem reinstalling Xubuntu 16.04

MR ZenWiz
I have a spare HP NW9440 laptop that I had running 14.04 for a while.
I replaced it with an 8710W a few years ago (that was recently stolen
and replaced) and hadn't used it in a while. I installed 16.04 on it
as a backup laptop for a good friend of mine, then it sat unused for a
while again.  Then I took out the drive with the intent of adding it
to my newer replacement notebook.  It seemed to work fine there

Now I can't install on the NW9440.  It failed part way through
installation on the replacement hard drive I put in. I thought it
might be the disk, so I put the previous one back, but it won't
install there either.

I tried using a USB flash drive and a DVD for the install medium, with
and without a network connection.

It gets to the "downloading 46 of 87 files" mark and all disk activity
stops, the cursor wheel stops spinning and it never gets past this
point.  I've waited for up to half an hour before giving up.  If I use
a network connection, that remains alive and flashing, but nothing
happens.

The mouse moves, but clicks generate no response, and nothing from the
keyboard works either.

I've tried adding noacpi and nomodeset to the boot command line, and
I've used the live CD/USB version to blaclist the tpm_tis driver
(which was also complaining for a while).  The PROM's TPM setting
makes no difference (enabled or disabled).  No noticeable effect.  I
even restored the factory defaults in the PROM.  Still nothing.

Given that this happens with both the USB and DVD media, I'm pretty
sure it isn't either of them. That leaves memory, CPU, m/b or disk
controller (m/b also).  Is there anything else?

What kind of tests can I run to determine what is causing this?  There
are a few diagnostics in the boot PROM, but I'm not sure which would
be of any use.  Are there any PROM settings I should look out for in
particular?

Thanks.
MR

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Re: Problem reinstalling Xubuntu 16.04

Liam Proven
On 4 April 2017 at 16:23, MR ZenWiz <[hidden email]> wrote:
> What kind of tests can I run to determine what is causing this?


Run Memtest86+ off the DVD boot menu. Leave it for a good long time,
e.g. overnight.

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Re: Problem reinstalling Xubuntu 16.04

Colin Law
On 4 April 2017 at 20:33, Liam Proven <[hidden email]> wrote:
On 4 April 2017 at 16:23, MR ZenWiz <[hidden email]> wrote:
> What kind of tests can I run to determine what is causing this?


Run Memtest86+ off the DVD boot menu. Leave it for a good long time,
e.g. overnight.

Also does it run ok if you select Try Ubuntu?

Also hit a key when it comes up with the initial screen right at the start of booting from the install media and select the option to check the files on the stick (can't remember exactly what words the option uses).

Colin
 

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Re: Problem reinstalling Xubuntu 16.04

MR ZenWiz
On Tue, Apr 4, 2017 at 1:20 PM, Colin Law <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Also does it run ok if you select Try Ubuntu?
>
Yes, it seems to run just fine until I try to install.

> Also hit a key when it comes up with the initial screen right at the start
> of booting from the install media and select the option to check the files
> on the stick (can't remember exactly what words the option uses).
>
Will do.

I ran the PROM memory and disk diagnostics - all went well.  I'm in
the process of wiping the disk using the PROM program (v e r y  s l o
w . . .).  When that's done, I'll do this, too.

Thanks.

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Re: Problem reinstalling Xubuntu 16.04

MR ZenWiz
On Tue, Apr 4, 2017 at 5:38 PM, MR ZenWiz <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On Tue, Apr 4, 2017 at 1:20 PM, Colin Law <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> Also hit a key when it comes up with the initial screen right at the start
>> of booting from the install media and select the option to check the files
>> on the stick (can't remember exactly what words the option uses).
>>
> Will do.
>
> I ran the PROM memory and disk diagnostics - all went well.  I'm in
> the process of wiping the disk using the PROM program (v e r y  s l o
> w . . .).  When that's done, I'll do this, too.
>
No help.  The tests all passed just fine, but the install gets some
ways in and just stops.  It's not always in the same place, but it's
almost as if the machine got tired and decided to sleep.  It seemed to
get farther from a fresh boot than after running the diagnostics, so
maybe heat problem?

Is there a way to install Ubuntu on a disk in a running system for use
in a different system?  That feels like it would be worth a shot, but
I've never seen anything on how to do it.  (Haven't googled for it yet
- can't until later.)

Thanks.

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Re: Problem reinstalling Xubuntu 16.04

Ralf Mardorf-2
On Wed, 5 Apr 2017 04:22:56 -0700, MR ZenWiz wrote:
>Is there a way to install Ubuntu on a disk in a running system for use
>in a different system?

You could install Ubuntu on machine 1, then backup the complete
install and after that restore from the backup on machine 2. Just the
bootloader needs to be written completely new. Maybe you also need to
edit a few things, when e.g. using an xorg.conf, you might need to
replace the graphics driver.

You also could remove the disk from computer 2, connect it to computer
1, install Ubuntu + bootloader and after that mount the drive to
computer 2 again.

Regards,
Ralf


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Re: Problem reinstalling Xubuntu 16.04

Nils Kassube-2
In reply to this post by MR ZenWiz
MR ZenWiz wrote:
> Is there a way to install Ubuntu on a disk in a running system for use
> in a different system?

You could put the disk in a USB enclosure and use a VM with USB access
to install Ubuntu. Use the downloaded ISO image as virtual DVD for the
installation and use the USB disk instead of a virtual disk image.


Nils


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Re: Problem reinstalling Xubuntu 16.04

Liam Proven
In reply to this post by MR ZenWiz
On 5 April 2017 at 13:22, MR ZenWiz <[hidden email]> wrote:
> No help.  The tests all passed just fine, but the install gets some
> ways in and just stops.  It's not always in the same place, but it's
> almost as if the machine got tired and decided to sleep.  It seemed to
> get farther from a fresh boot than after running the diagnostics, so
> maybe heat problem?


It's possible. Does it make a lot of fan noise?

Desktop or laptop?

If the former: open and clean thoroughly, with a sprayduster or
similar, observing ESD & fan speed precautions etc. Google for
details.

If the latter: Google for disassembly instructions.  Consider whether
it's worth it.

Or, install on a different machine and copy the partition across.

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Re: Problem reinstalling Xubuntu 16.04

MR ZenWiz
On Wed, Apr 5, 2017 at 5:57 AM, Liam Proven <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> It's possible. Does it make a lot of fan noise?
>
No, just the normal sounds and it's exhausting heat fairly well,
nothing extreme.

> Desktop or laptop?
>
> If the latter: Google for disassembly instructions.  Consider whether
> it's worth it.
>
Laptop.  Not sure if it's worth it.

> Or, install on a different machine and copy the partition across.
>
Working on this one.

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Re: Problem reinstalling Xubuntu 16.04

MR ZenWiz
In reply to this post by Nils Kassube-2
On Wed, Apr 5, 2017 at 5:18 AM, Nils Kassube <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> You could put the disk in a USB enclosure and use a VM with USB access
> to install Ubuntu. Use the downloaded ISO image as virtual DVD for the
> installation and use the USB disk instead of a virtual disk image.
>
I tried that with VirtualBox.  I had to look up how to attach a real
("raw") hard drive, but it seemed to work.

However, when I plugged the drive into the laptop, it did not boot.  I
rebooted from the flash drive to "try" Xubuntu, and it does not like
the hard drive format at all - it's not ext4 or vfat.

I ran gparted from a flash drive on the laptop with the drive put back
in, and it showed as unformatted, even though it installed just fine
in the VM.

So, I'm installing from my main laptop with its primary disk removed
(temporarily).

What a pain.

Thanks for all the advice.  Hopefully it will actually install and
boot this time in the old laptop so I'll still have an available if
somewhat decrepit spare.

MR

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Re: Problem reinstalling Xubuntu 16.04

Liam Proven
On 5 April 2017 at 22:35, MR ZenWiz <[hidden email]> wrote:
> I tried that with VirtualBox.  I had to look up how to attach a real
> ("raw") hard drive, but it seemed to work.
>
> However, when I plugged the drive into the laptop, it did not boot.  I
> rebooted from the flash drive to "try" Xubuntu, and it does not like
> the hard drive format at all - it's not ext4 or vfat.


Odd. I've done exactly this. I have an installation of Lubuntu 16.04
on an 8GB USB key. It boots into a full local desktop, on any BIOS
machine.

N.B. Attach the entire USB key device -- not a partition

http://liam-on-linux.livejournal.com/50416.htmln it.

Run only in a VM when updating, or in a diskless PC, or else GRUB will
add all the entries on your hard disk to the USB key's boot menu.

But I can confirm it *does* work.

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Re: Problem reinstalling Xubuntu 16.04

MR ZenWiz
On Wed, Apr 5, 2017 at 1:48 PM, Liam Proven <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On 5 April 2017 at 22:35, MR ZenWiz <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> I tried that with VirtualBox.  I had to look up how to attach a real
>> ("raw") hard drive, but it seemed to work.
>>
>> However, when I plugged the drive into the laptop, it did not boot.  I
>> rebooted from the flash drive to "try" Xubuntu, and it does not like
>> the hard drive format at all - it's not ext4 or vfat.
>
> Odd. I've done exactly this. I have an installation of Lubuntu 16.04
> on an 8GB USB key. It boots into a full local desktop, on any BIOS
> machine.
>
> N.B. Attach the entire USB key device -- not a partition
>
> http://liam-on-linux.livejournal.com/50416.htmln it.
>
> Run only in a VM when updating, or in a diskless PC, or else GRUB will
> add all the entries on your hard disk to the USB key's boot menu.
>
> But I can confirm it *does* work.
>
I believe you.  I may have mistyped something because one of my
desktop's hard drives got corrupted and I'm having to restore it.  2TB
drive that was about half full.  Ick.

However, I put the drive into my main notebook and installed Xubuntu
on it, then took it out and put back the correct one (for the
notebook) and that still works just fine.

I installed the drive into the problem laptop and it still won't boot.
It comes up in BusyBox after about a minute, but all the inidcators
mentioned there are correct - the UUID matches, all the files are in
the right place, but it won't boot.

I rebooted from the Live flash drive and did the recovery bit per the
instructions in AskUbuntu (mount the drive, mount-bind /dev, /proc,
/run and /sys, chroot to /mnt, run update-grub, exit and reboot) and
that did not work.

I added the step of reinstalling grub on the disk (/dev/sda), reran
the update grub, and it still fails.

I remain open to suggestions (please don't suggest I ditch the thing -
that may be next).

What logs might be useful and what would I look for?  I've never seen
anything quite like this before.

Thanks.

MR

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Re: Problem reinstalling Xubuntu 16.04

MR ZenWiz
Update:

I was able to put in an old hard drive that has both Windows 7 and
(X?)Ubuntu 11.04 on it.  Both boot, but I couldn't remember any of the
passwords.

I recovered the Windows password and was able to boot it all the way
up, but I still have to recover the Ubuntu password and try it.

The real question is this: why does it boot from this ancient 80GB
hard drive in two different OSes, but not from either of a 320 or
120GB hard drive that have Xubuntu on them?  I know it's not the disks
- they're both in good shape, and the 320GB one passed badblocks -w
checking.

One thing i forgot to mention, though I'm not sure how this owuld
matter - I've been running the laptop on the power cord, no battery.

How else can I check out the disk controller of the hardware to see if
it's that?

Thanks.

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Re: Problem reinstalling Xubuntu 16.04

Ralf Mardorf-2
On Fri, 7 Apr 2017 16:10:31 -0700, MR ZenWiz wrote:
>The real question is this: why does it boot from this ancient 80GB
>hard drive in two different OSes, but not from either of a 320 or
>120GB hard drive that have Xubuntu on them?

What messages do you get?

Just in case you should use a splash screen:
http://askubuntu.com/questions/33416/how-do-i-disable-the-boot-splash-screen-and-only-show-kernel-and-boot-text-inst

At what stage booting stops? Does it boot at all or do you just get
GRUB messages?

To ensure that it isn't an user error when installing and setting up
GRUB and also to ensure that it's not a GRUB related bug, you could try
using another bootloader. For my taste syslinux anyway is the better
choice http://packages.ubuntu.com/xenial/syslinux , but I'm sure that a
lot of Ubuntu users would dislike it.

Regards,
Ralf


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Re: Problem reinstalling Xubuntu 16.04

MR ZenWiz
On Sat, Apr 8, 2017 at 2:30 AM, Ralf Mardorf <[hidden email]> wrote:
> On Fri, 7 Apr 2017 16:10:31 -0700, MR ZenWiz wrote:
>>The real question is this: why does it boot from this ancient 80GB
>>hard drive in two different OSes, but not from either of a 320 or
>>120GB hard drive that have Xubuntu on them?
>
> What messages do you get?
>
I misspoke - it will boot from the old 80GB hard drive, Windows 7 and
Ubuntu 11.04, but it won't install on the other two disks.  It boots
from the install DVD or USB drive, but it hangs part way through
installation, a different place every time.

IIRC, when I booted the externally installed Xubuntu 16.04 on the
320GB drive, it started to boot, stopped for a long wihle, then came
up in BusyBox saying there was a disk i/o error, but not which one.
It suggested checking the command line (correct), checking the UUID on
the command line (correct), checking the drive parameters (none) and
one other thing I can't recall, but i used the BusyBox commands to
check all of these and nothing showed up as off.  It just won't boot
from the bigger drives (it used to work just fine last time I was
running it, a few weeks ago).

I'll try again today with the battery in and the power cord, but I'm
ready to leave it with the 80GB drive and just pull it out for those
times when I have to use a Windows machine and the VM won't do
(separate issue coming soon), like with the DHS I-9 PDF forms that
require Adobe Acrobat Reader in order to function properly.

Thanks.

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Re: Problem reinstalling Xubuntu 16.04

MR ZenWiz
On Sat, Apr 8, 2017 at 1:07 PM, MR ZenWiz <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
> I misspoke - it will boot from the old 80GB hard drive, Windows 7 and
> Ubuntu 11.04, but it won't install on the other two disks.  It boots
> from the install DVD or USB drive, but it hangs part way through
> installation, a different place every time.
>
> IIRC, when I booted the externally installed Xubuntu 16.04 on the
> 320GB drive, it started to boot, stopped for a long wihle, then came
> up in BusyBox saying there was a disk i/o error, but not which one.
> It suggested checking the command line (correct), checking the UUID on
> the command line (correct), checking the drive parameters (none) and
> one other thing I can't recall, but i used the BusyBox commands to
> check all of these and nothing showed up as off.  It just won't boot
> from the bigger drives (it used to work just fine last time I was
> running it, a few weeks ago).
>
> I'll try again today with the battery in and the power cord, but I'm
> ready to leave it with the 80GB drive and just pull it out for those
> times when I have to use a Windows machine and the VM won't do
> (separate issue coming soon), like with the DHS I-9 PDF forms that
> require Adobe Acrobat Reader in order to function properly.
>
> Thanks.

Here's a link to a photo I took after five minutes of it not moving
during 16.04 installation to overwrite the Ubuntu 11.04 that was
there.

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B-3x0QT9-7fIX0tobC1Qc181aWc

Apparently 16.04 really does not like this hardware.

As it happens, the on-board Win7 also is giving me grief - it says my
copy is not authorized.  Probably because this disk was in a different
laptop before.  I'm amazed it runs 7 a all, since it used to run XP.

So much fun.

Are there any decent hardware level diagnostics to ferret out what may
be wrong with the disk controller?  I've never seen any.

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Re: Problem reinstalling Xubuntu 16.04

Ralf Mardorf-2
On Sat, 8 Apr 2017 18:51:07 -0700, MR ZenWiz wrote:
>https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B-3x0QT9-7fIX0tobC1Qc181aWc

Is there no way to get rid of the graphical thingy, maybe by pushing
the escape-key?

Try installing from the Ubunbtu server image. The installer likely
still is ncursed based. I guess it also doesn't provide detailed
output, but you at least could uncheck as much as possible, when it
asked you what software to install. This is how I installed my Ubuntu.
IOW my install wasn't a default server install, it was less than a
default server install. I used the server image, since it was the
minimalist available development image. IIRC for official releases there
exists something that by default already is less than a server install.

The more minimalist you start, the easier it's to troubleshoot and apart
from this, the easier it's to customize the install.

Such a minimalist Ubuntu install still fits to the rubric
"user-friendly", other than for e.g. Arch Linux a minimalist Ubuntu
still automatically starts services and configs are in the same way
ready to use, as for the default Ubuntu flavours, you just have to
manually install one package after the other, X, desktop environment
etc..

In short, you don't need to have the skills you need to install a
distro such as Arch Linux, but you still could install one after the
other package. I'm doing this to customize my install and you could use
it to become aware of the culprit causing the issue.

Regards,
Ralf

PS: Does the GUI of the photo provide at least a hint? I can't read it.


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Re: Problem reinstalling Xubuntu 16.04

Petter Adsen-2
On 09/04/17 04:24, Ralf Mardorf wrote:
> Try installing from the Ubunbtu server image. The installer likely
> still is ncursed based. I guess it also doesn't provide detailed
> output, but you at least could uncheck as much as possible, when it

Also, if you don't want the server packages try the Lubuntu alternate
image. Same ncurses installer, but just installs a minimal Ubuntu if you
don't select the Lubuntu stuff. Like the server image, there is a debug
log running on VC4 (Alt+F4 to access). This might be helpful if the
installer fails.

> default server install. I used the server image, since it was the
> minimalist available development image. IIRC for official releases there
> exists something that by default already is less than a server install.

Yes, there is also the netboot mini.iso. It will also work as long as
you don't require UEFI support. There are no packages on it, so network
is required during installation AFAIK.

> The more minimalist you start, the easier it's to troubleshoot and apart
> from this, the easier it's to customize the install.

+1

Good luck,

Petter

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Re: Problem reinstalling Xubuntu 16.04

Ralf Mardorf-2
On Sun, 9 Apr 2017 10:19:37 +0200, Petter Adsen wrote:
>Like the server image, there is a debug log running on VC4 (Alt+F4 to
>access). This might be helpful if the installer fails.

That's a good hint!

If the OP shouldn't have done this already, he could consider to check
the download against a signed checksum with an Ubuntu public key.

I wrote a script that automatically downloads and checks any of the
available Ubuntu flavours for 64-bit architecture, but it's not for the
server image.

To get Lubuntu 16.04 the OP could install the attached script and run:

  chmod a+x /path/luamd64_1610.sh
  /path/luamd64_1610.sh lubuntu 16.04.2

Regards,
Ralf

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Re: Problem reinstalling Xubuntu 16.04

Liam Proven
In reply to this post by Ralf Mardorf-2
On 9 April 2017 at 04:24, Ralf Mardorf <[hidden email]> wrote:
> Try installing from the Ubunbtu server image.


That, or using the alternate network install CD, were what I was going
to suggest.

https://www.ubuntu.com/download/alternative-downloads



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