Hello everyone i am a newbie to Linux and i am using the live cd to On 11/5/05, [hidden email] <[hidden email]> wrote:
Send ubuntu-users mailing list submissions to -- Jayasimha Yerramilli Technical Support Engineer, MKS Inc. Bangalore 9880381405 -- ubuntu-users mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-users |
There Should be a PDF version soon, and we all need to be paitient, bookmark and keep an eye on this 'site which is the new breezy guide' (http://ubuntuguide.squarecows.com/doku.php) site and appears to be coming along very nicely and has RSS feed for recent changes. The maintainers intend to have a pdf version soon. Can I ask why you need a pdf version now? There may be a way that you can make one. -- essexman -- ubuntu-users mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-users |
On za, 2005-11-05 at 05:59 -0500, 'Forum Post wrote:
> There Should be a PDF version soon, and we all need to be paitient, > bookmark and keep an eye on this 'site which is the new breezy guide' NO. Ubuntuguide should no linger be encouraged/pointed to, now that we have proper official documentation. -- Dennis K. - Linux for human beings: http://www.ubuntulinux.org - Linux voor normale mensen: http://www.ubuntulinux.nl -- ubuntu-users mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-users |
Dennis Kaarsemaker Wrote: > > > NO. Ubuntuguide should no linger be encouraged/pointed to, now that we > have proper official documentation. > -- > Dennis K. > - Linux for human beings: http://www.ubuntulinux.org > - Linux voor normale mensen: http://www.ubuntulinux.nl > > -- > ubuntu-users mailing list > ubuntu-users (AT) lists (DOT) ubuntu.com > http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-users > > Dennis This is a negative post. It is a good idea to read the guidelines on 'posting a reply to a techinical query' (http://tinyurl.com/d6859). Rather than say something > "should no linger be encouraged/pointed to" not to be encouraged/pointed to the onus is on you to Encourage and/or Point to a solution. -- essexman -- ubuntu-users mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-users |
On zo, 2005-11-06 at 07:52 -0500, 'Forum Post wrote:
> This is a negative post. Yes, with good reason. Ubuntuguide instructions break a lot and should not be used. > It is a good idea to read the guidelines on 'posting a reply to a > techinical query' (http://tinyurl.com/d6859). Remember that this is a mailing list governed by the code of conduct and no other guidelines. > Rather than say something > "should no linger be encouraged/pointed to" not to be encouraged/pointed to the onus is on you to Encourage and/or > Point to a solution. http://help.ubuntu.com/ 'System -> help' in the ubuntu main menu. -- Dennis K. - Linux for human beings: http://www.ubuntulinux.org - Linux voor normale mensen: http://www.ubuntulinux.nl -- ubuntu-users mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-users |
Dennis Kaarsemaker Wrote: > > > > This is a negative post. > > Yes, with good reason. Ubuntuguide instructions break a lot and should > not be used. > > > It is a good idea to read the guidelines on 'posting a reply to a > > techinical query' ('http://tinyurl.com/d6859)' > (http://tinyurl.com/d6859%29). > > Remember that this is a mailing list governed by the code of conduct > and > no other guidelines. > > > > Dennis I don't know the URL you are reading this from but mine reads as follows: http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p=470720#post470720 Check out the domain, there is a big clue. This is a public forum. I am sure you are doing tremendous work for the docs team, but you are no help hear. If you think that the original post should not have been on the mailing list thread - then you can get it moved somewhere else. You have been no help here and it is difficult to figure out what your agenda is - I can not see any clear 'Humanity'. It seems as if you wish to ignore what has been written and ignore any guidelines other than what ever happens to suit you. However, you do mention the code of conduct, so may i respectfully remind you: - *Be considerate* - *Be respectful* - *Be collaborative* - *When you disagree, consult others* - *When you are unsure, ask for help* - *Step down considerately* We'll see where we takes us, and at the end, I will step down considerately. But first I would like to see you get back onto the original thread topic, reposted to a technical forum if necessary, and then fixed for the original poster, who after all, was someone with a problem, who needs help finding a solution. -- essexman -- ubuntu-users mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-users |
The original post, as well as Dennis's reply, wasn't to the forum--it
was to the ubuntu-users mailing list. It just happens that the mailing list is mirrored to the forum--a service for the convenience of forum users who don't want to sign up to the mailing list. And with regards to Dennis's advice on avoiding unofficial documentation, it is valid and helpful, and may help unititiated users avoid serious breakage, potentially turning them off to Ubuntu & Linux in general. As far as the original question, the best place to go for documentation is help.ubuntu.com, as mentioned previously. As you get more seasoned and become comfortable that you can fix things that break, you may want to turn to unofficial guides for specific things not covered in the official guide. Do so at your own risk, though. If you want PDF documentation there is a package called cups-pdf. It let's you create a printer that prints to a pdf file instead of a physical printer, which is great for making web pages available to read where there's no internet. It takes a bit of work to get going, but could be a sufficiently challenging project for a beginner. (Hint: to get it working you have to edit /etc/cups/cupsd.conf and set RunAsUser to No--this causes cups to run as root). On the windows side, since you're using the Live CD, there is a really great project called PDF Creator. It is an open source project on sourceforge.net. You can also get it from The Open CD, www.theopencd.org. If you pop your Ubuntu Live CD into a Windows computer, it contains information about The Open CD, as well as a subset of the Open CD's windows software. Hope this helps Good Luck On 11/6/05, 'Forum Post <[hidden email]> wrote: > > Dennis Kaarsemaker Wrote: > > > > > > > This is a negative post. > > > > Yes, with good reason. Ubuntuguide instructions break a lot and should > > not be used. > > > > > It is a good idea to read the guidelines on 'posting a reply to a > > > techinical query' ('http://tinyurl.com/d6859)' > > (http://tinyurl.com/d6859%29). > > > > Remember that this is a mailing list governed by the code of conduct > > and > > no other guidelines. > > > > > > > > > > Dennis > > I don't know the URL you are reading this from but mine reads as > follows: > > http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p=470720#post470720 > > Check out the domain, there is a big clue. This is a public forum. > > I am sure you are doing tremendous work for the docs team, but you are > no help hear. > > If you think that the original post should not have been on the mailing > list thread - then you can get it moved somewhere else. You have been > no help here and it is difficult to figure out what your agenda is - I > can not see any clear 'Humanity'. > > It seems as if you wish to ignore what has been written and ignore any > guidelines other than what ever happens to suit you. > > However, you do mention the code of conduct, so may i respectfully > remind you: > > - *Be considerate* > - *Be respectful* > - *Be collaborative* > - *When you disagree, consult others* > - *When you are unsure, ask for help* > - *Step down considerately* We'll see where we takes us, and at the end, I will step down > considerately. > > But first I would like to see you get back onto the original thread > topic, reposted to a technical forum if necessary, and then fixed for > the original poster, who after all, was someone with a problem, who > needs help finding a solution. > > > -- > essexman > > -- > ubuntu-users mailing list > [hidden email] > http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-users > -- If you reply to a message I posted to a mailing list, and you want me to see your reply, be sure to put my address in the 'To:', or I might not see the message. -- ubuntu-users mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-users |
In reply to this post by chrisccoulson
essexman Wrote: > Dennis > > I don't know the URL you are reading this from but mine reads as > follows: > > http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p=470720#post470720 > > Check out the domain, there is a big clue. This is a public forum. Essexman, This may surprise you, but this forum - is only a gateway to the ubuntu-users mailing list. Hence the mailing list rules apply (you can subscribe here http://lists.ubuntulinux.org/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-users if you wish) essexman Wrote: > I am sure you are doing tremendous work for the docs team, but you are > no help hear. > > If you think that the original post should not have been on the mailing > list thread - then you can get it moved somewhere else. You have been > no help here and it is difficult to figure out what your agenda is - I > can not see any clear 'Humanity'.Dennis is merely following the wishes of the Ubuntu developers by trying to stear the original poster away from the dangerous/misguided/and often incorrect ubuntu guide, to correct documentation that I will also reiterate can be found here: http://help.ubuntu.com/ 'System -> help' in the ubuntu main menu. essexman Wrote: > It seems as if you wish to ignore what has been written and ignore any > guidelines other than what ever happens to suit you. It rather seems that Dennis is getting tired repeating this often. essexman Wrote: > But first I would like to see you get back onto the original thread > topic, reposted to a technical forum if necessary, and then fixed for > the original poster, who after all, was someone with a problem, who > needs help finding a solution. Thank you for trying to assist the original poster, he should be able to find useful documentation in 'System -> help' in the ubuntu main menu, when he starts his Ubuntu system. -- Yagisan -- ubuntu-users mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-users |
In reply to this post by chrisccoulson
On zo, 2005-11-06 at 10:01 -0500, 'Forum Post wrote:
> I don't know the URL you are reading this from but mine reads as > follows: > > http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p=470720#post470720 This is a mailing list, the forum is merely a gateway to it. Stop reminding me about the CoC, I know it -- I am an Ubuntu member. If you want to play forum police, fine by me, but don't do that on the mailing list. -- Dennis K. - Linux for human beings: http://www.ubuntulinux.org - Linux voor normale mensen: http://www.ubuntulinux.nl -- ubuntu-users mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-users |
In reply to this post by zach-7
Zach Wrote: > The original post, as well as Dennis's reply, wasn't to the forum--it > was to the ubuntu-users mailing list. It just happens that the > mailing list is mirrored to the forum--a service for the convenience > of forum users who don't want to sign up to the mailing list. > > And with regards to Dennis's advice on avoiding unofficial > documentation, it is valid and helpful, and may help unititiated users > avoid serious breakage, potentially turning them off to Ubuntu & Linux > in general. > > As far as the original question, the best place to go for > documentation is help.ubuntu.com, as mentioned previously. As you get > more seasoned and become comfortable that you can fix things that > break, you may want to turn to unofficial guides for specific things > not covered in the official guide. Do so at your own risk, though. > > If you want PDF documentation there is a package called cups-pdf. It > let's you create a printer that prints to a pdf file instead of a > physical printer, which is great for making web pages available to > read where there's no internet. It takes a bit of work to get going, > but could be a sufficiently challenging project for a beginner. > (Hint: to get it working you have to edit /etc/cups/cupsd.conf and set > RunAsUser to No--this causes cups to run as root). > > On the windows side, since you're using the Live CD, there is a really > great project called PDF Creator. It is an open source project on > sourceforge.net. You can also get it from The Open CD, > 'www.theopencd.org' (http://www.theopencd.org). If you pop your Ubuntu > Live CD into a Windows > computer, it contains information about The Open CD, as well as a > subset of the Open CD's windows software. > > Hope this helps > Good Luck > > '' (http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-users) Zach Thanks for taking a positive and posting a response that should help the original poster. As to the whys and where for's of the mailing list appearing on the forums, the fact is it is there. I have no issue with someone posting a better/ more useful reply to a post. The Denis's reply, was of no help, it doesn't really matter if it was posted to the moon. According to the Code of Coduct the guidlines are the same for the Mailing lists as they are for the forums. The post was public and stemed from a technical querey. Maybe you feel it would be better if the mailing lists were made private; members only? -- essexman -- ubuntu-users mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-users |
On zo, 2005-11-06 at 11:24 -0500, 'Forum Post wrote:
> Maybe you feel it would be better if the mailing lists were made > private; members only? They are. List members just appear as guest on the forums. My reply was helpful to the original poster, since I steer him away from the crud that is ubuntuguide (and no, this is not a violation of the CoC: it is preventing someone from wrecking his system). PLease stop patronizing and playing police officer. THAT is a CoC violation. -- Dennis K. - Linux for human beings: http://www.ubuntulinux.org - Linux voor normale mensen: http://www.ubuntulinux.nl -- ubuntu-users mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-users |
In reply to this post by chrisccoulson
On 11/6/05, 'Forum Post <[hidden email]> wrote:
> The Denis's reply, was of no > help, it doesn't really matter if it was posted to the moon. According His reply was helpful. The original poster now understands the risks of what could be a potential pitfall. So many pitfalls I could have avoided, had someone steered me clear of conflicting HOWTOs, etc. > > Maybe you feel it would be better if the mailing lists were made > private; members only? I think my sentiment and that of many other contributers to this thread is that this level criticism of what is posted to the mailing list from someone who hasn't even bothered to subscribe to the list, isn't welcome. The list isn't private--any may join it who wish to. Providing a gateway to the list from within the forum is a convenience only, making it a searchable and easily accessible medium. Those who desire to participate actively and regularly would best serve themselves and others by joining the list. > > > -- > essexman > > -- > ubuntu-users mailing list > [hidden email] > http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-users > -- If you reply to a message I posted to a mailing list, and you want me to see your reply, be sure to put my address in the 'To:', or I might not see the message. -- ubuntu-users mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-users |
On zo, 2005-11-06 at 11:56 -0500, Zach wrote:
> I think my sentiment and that of many other contributers to this > thread is that this level criticism of what is posted to the mailing > list from someone who hasn't even bothered to subscribe to the list, > isn't welcome. I couldn't agree more, especially given the amount of nonsense coming from the forum to the list. -- Dennis K. - Linux for human beings: http://www.ubuntulinux.org - Linux voor normale mensen: http://www.ubuntulinux.nl -- ubuntu-users mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-users |
In reply to this post by zach-7
Zach wrote:
> The original post, as well as Dennis's reply, wasn't to the forum--it > was to the ubuntu-users mailing list. It just happens that the > mailing list is mirrored to the forum--a service for the convenience > of forum users who don't want to sign up to the mailing list. Wow. It was bad enough when someone decided that the Forum should be gated to our list and we ended up with an influx of posts from people who not only couldn't quote but probably get annoyed that we list-users _do_. It was worse when someone else decided that all of those posts should appear to be from 'Forum user. Now they're trying to make us abide by _their_ posting rules?? I really wish the ubuntu-user admins would just break this gateway and let both the list and the Forum go their own way. It's one thing gating a list to gmane news, but it's completely different, and imo unworkable, to gate to an HTML forum. The formats are too incompatible. > And with regards to Dennis's advice on avoiding unofficial > documentation, it is valid and helpful, and may help unititiated users > avoid serious breakage, potentially turning them off to Ubuntu & Linux > in general. Yes. > > As far as the original question, the best place to go for > documentation is help.ubuntu.com, as mentioned previously. As you get > more seasoned and become comfortable that you can fix things that > break, you may want to turn to unofficial guides for specific things > not covered in the official guide. Do so at your own risk, though. > > If you want PDF documentation there is a package called cups-pdf. It > let's you create a printer that prints to a pdf file instead of a > physical printer, which is great for making web pages available to > read where there's no internet. It takes a bit of work to get going, > but could be a sufficiently challenging project for a beginner. > (Hint: to get it working you have to edit /etc/cups/cupsd.conf and set > RunAsUser to No--this causes cups to run as root). > > On the windows side, since you're using the Live CD, there is a really > great project called PDF Creator. It is an open source project on > sourceforge.net. You can also get it from The Open CD, > www.theopencd.org. If you pop your Ubuntu Live CD into a Windows > computer, it contains information about The Open CD, as well as a > subset of the Open CD's windows software. > > Hope this helps > Good Luck > > On 11/6/05, 'Forum Post <[hidden email]> wrote: >> >> I don't know the URL you are reading this from but mine reads as >> follows: >> >> http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p=470720#post470720 Which is completely irrelevant to the ubuntu-users mailing list. >> However, you do mention the code of conduct, so may i respectfully >> remind you: >> >> - *Be considerate* He was. >> - *Be respectful* He was. Personally, I consider anonymous posts from "'Forum post" disrespectful. >> - *Be collaborative* >> - *When you disagree, consult others* It certainly seems to be the consensus position that ubuntuguide is no longer a reliable source of documentation, so both of those points are covered. >> But first I would like to see you get back onto the original thread >> topic, reposted to a technical forum if necessary, and then fixed for >> the original poster, who after all, was someone with a problem, who >> needs help finding a solution. Just because somebody asks for a specific solution doesn't mean he should be given that advice. The specific solution he wanted was wrong and his advice was good. -- derek -- ubuntu-users mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-users |
In reply to this post by chrisccoulson
essexman Wrote: > If people are getting tired of typing: > > > Then maybe there is an issue that needs covering? Continually posting > sounds like another way of saying FTFM. > > And neither would have helped the questioner. > > And when I recommend that people follow the guidelines, it is because > they are good guidlines. > > And nothing surprises me. Thank you for looking down at me, I had assumed that you were trying to be genuinely helpful, but alas, it seems you wanted to play forum policeman. Had I wished to say Read The F***ng Manual, I assure I would. Now, lets be honest here, the original poster wants to Ubuntuguide because they want some information in there. What that is, we don't know, because they didn't tell us, so we can't point them in the direction of accurate documentaion already on their Ubuntu system, so instead we point to a website, and the help button on their system. You don't seem to think this is helpful. I think you are rather biased, with your complaints about the mailing list here http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=86717 and your patronising tone is not appreciated. As for that link you posted to the new (but not improved ubuntu guide), shall I start to point out problems with it ? hmm, lets see, how about these repositories it tells you to add ubuntuguide Wrote: > > ## Backports > > deb http://ubuntu-backports.mirrormax.net/ breezy-extras main > multiverse restricted universe > > ## Staging + extras > > deb http://ubuntu-backports.mirrormax.net/ breezy-backports-staging > main multiverse restricted universe > deb http://ubuntu-backports.mirrormax.net/ breezy-extras-staging main > multiverse restricted universe Yes, lets add repo's that are likely to break our system. There are offical ubuntu backports, but I don't see that in the guide. I know, lets break the system but f***ing around with the internet conection, like with the gem that starts like this ubuntuguide Wrote: > wget -c http://frankandjacq.com/ubuntuguide/rp-pppoe-3.6.tar.gz > sudo tar zxvf rp-pppoe-3.6.tar.gz -C /opt/ > sudo chown -R root:root /opt/rp-pppoe-3.6/ > sudo gedit /usr/share/applications/RP-PPPoE.desktop Considering that pppoe is in universe, this dangerous (possibly trojaned) software is unneeded. Oddly enough, ppp (in main) connects well over "pppoe" connections, how do I know - I'm using it right now. Shall I go on ? OK how about the fact that it is assumed you have an i386 machine. If you don't, say you have amd64 or powerpc - ubuntuguide will not work for you. Please do tell, why won't this ubuntuguide Wrote: > sudo apt-get install w32codecs work on amd64 or powerpc ? It's in ubuntuguide, it must work, but not on my system. It won't work so ubuntu must be teh suxsors right ? -- Yagisan -- ubuntu-users mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-users |
In reply to this post by Derek Broughton-2
Derek Thank you for pointing out that my posts were anonymus. I was not away of this and you can see thing from my point of view ( if you want to) here: http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=86406&page=2 I apologise to this mailing list for apearing like an obnoxius outsider; I had not realised that this was the case. I have been subscribed to the list for some time - but the likelyhood of me participating is now zero. I hope people feel very good about venting their anger on me, and I hope the original poster now has a working printer. -- essexman -- ubuntu-users mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-users |
Yagisan, Dennis, and Zach I have calmed down now, (and eaten), and would like to apologise to you all. I have unwittingly stumbled in on your territory, and caused offence and this was not my intention. If I am not the first person to do this, and you all feel this needs preventing then a solution might be to have Ryan adjust the posting rules to make the list 'View only" from the forums? -- essexman -- ubuntu-users mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-users |
I doubt seriously that anyone is offended. And as mentioned before
this is an open list anyone may join who wishes to do so. It isn't anyone's territory. Open debate is part of the spirit of open source. On 11/6/05, 'Forum Post <[hidden email]> wrote: > > Yagisan, Dennis, and Zach > > I have calmed down now, (and eaten), and would like to apologise to you > all. > > I have unwittingly stumbled in on your territory, and caused offence > and this was not my intention. > > If I am not the first person to do this, and you all feel this needs > preventing then a solution might be to have Ryan adjust the posting > rules to make the list 'View only" from the forums? > > > -- > essexman > > -- > ubuntu-users mailing list > [hidden email] > http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-users > -- If you reply to a message I posted to a mailing list, and you want me to see your reply, be sure to put my address in the 'To:', or I might not see the message. -- ubuntu-users mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-users |
In reply to this post by chrisccoulson
essexman Wrote: > Yagisan, Dennis, and Zach > > I have calmed down now, (and eaten), and would like to apologise to you > all. > > I have unwittingly stumbled in on your territory, and caused offence > and this was not my intention. > > If I am not the first person to do this, and you all feel this needs > preventing then a solution might be to have Ryan adjust the posting > rules to make the list 'View only" from the forums? I'm not offended, and if I seem abrasive, my apologies. All of us wish to stear the original poster to suitable documentation, we obviously disagree on what is suitable documentation. To make it clear, I am in no way, shape, or form affliated with the doc team, nor do I consider the list my territory Please continue to join in on the list, as all are welcome. Regards Yagisan (who is away from his pc, and hence is using the forum to post) -- Yagisan -- ubuntu-users mailing list [hidden email] http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-users |
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